christian looking to understand athiests

[Mister Agenda]

Err... I don't understand that at all, sorry.

So what does he change, when you pray? Does he alter other people's free will in order to fulfil your prayer? What does he do that creates a change exactly?

he cant and never will change anyones free will because we are all entitled to believe whatever we want and do whatever we want.  theres been many different ways that he answers prayers.  if i tried to explain any someone would just say its a coincidence or luck.

If he had actually stuck to that policy in the case of Pharoah, the story of Exodus would have had a lot fewer plagues.

It's good that you recognize the weaknesses in your story. The question is, why you would invoke divine intervention to explain events that you know can be explained by psychology and probability? I know it's because of your faith, and that's fine, you can't help of what you're convinced; what I mean is, why bring it up as a reason for believing when it's clearly the believing that came first?

[Brian37]

hello,  i am a born again christian who is looking to understand and discuss your reasons for being an athiest. i am NOT here to argue or change your mind.

Simple to understand. We don't hold the position that there is any type of God for the same reason you rightfully reject claims of Apollo or Thor, just like those claims once beloved, your book and traditions started in an age of scientific ignorance.

[Rhondazvous]

i see that most of you believe what you do because of lack of evidence that there is a God.  Personally i am a christian because of all the evidence ive seen and the ways ive seen him answer prayers.  ive had people come up to me and pray for problems that i was having that i hadnt told anyone.  ive had many prayers awnsered in ways that could only be explained by God.  I also completely understand everyone heres point of view

I was a Christian for 25 years and I know how that works. You pray 100 prayers and if you get 5 of the things you pray for, you take it as proof that god answers prayers. This is the same odds people use when playing the lottery. They buy $100 worth of lottery tickets then if hey win $5, they think they're ahead of the game.

If you were honest with yourself, has anything ever happened to you that can't be interpreted in several ways? You've been indoctrinated to see god's hand in your life, but if you had not been so indoctrinated, you would ascribe those same experiences to circumstances other than god.

[Kingpin]

hello,  i am a born again christian who is looking to understand and discuss your reasons for being an athiest. i am NOT here to argue or change your mind.

This is a noble question, but as a 14 yr old pastor's daughter I must ask the intent.  Are you experiencing doubt or looking for ways to speak to non-believers maybe?  I applaud you not wanting to preach at people, but I'm still intrigued by the purpose of asking the question.

[Mister Agenda]

What is free will?

its when you decide everything you want to do and make decisions in your life.  God cant force you to do anything because you have free will.  Eve had free will in the garden of eden and she could either eat or not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.  with her free will she decided to eat the fruit

It wasn't a very informed free will, since she didn't know good from evil until after she ate the fruit. More like a toddler's free will to put anything it can reach into its mouth.

That whole story is a lot better as a metaphor for our tendency to do wrong even though we want to do right than taken literally. Literally, it's like someone knowingly leaving their two three-year-old twins in a room with their worst enemy and a loaded shotgun that you've told them to leave alone, then punishing the kids and all of their descendants because the shotgun went off. You don't have to be omniscient to know that the person most repsonsible for that outcome is the parent.

[Rhondazvous]

I have no idea what an "athiest" is. The state of being the most athie?

You know how to make me laugh.

[Mister Agenda]

I have news for you. Death was happening long before the fictional events in your imaginary Eden.

there really is no discussion here if you are just going to shoot down everything i say.

I was given to understand that you started this thread to understand atheists. If that's really for what you're here, answers like those of Crossless1's are highly illuminating.

Just trying to help you be philosophical about it.

[Mister Agenda]

God wont automatically grant any prayer you pray just because your saved.  if he does not answer a prayer how you want immediately it means he has a plan that could be better then what you prayed

This touches on something I said earlier: God shouldn't fulfill any prayer that isn't better than what he was going to do anyway, and logically no prayer CAN be better than what God was going to do anyway. Prayers would only seem to be fulfilled when you asked for what God was going to do anyway.

[pocaracas]

a couple of examples are some people at my church 

AWww, how cute.... we have examples of real people with real medical problems that got solved after praying, after having been present for too log before the believer with the problem even bothered to pray for it... -.-'

a woman almost lost her legs because they were filled with fluid and God had told her years ago that he would heal her.  she continued praying and within a week her legs were almost back to normal and the doctor had no medical explanantion

Wait, what?!
"god had told her years ago" ?! HOW???
Did she spend all those years with that fluid? And only bothered to pray after years and years of neglect?

a man at our church had his hip bone injured by being crushed between two boats in the navy,  the bone was never healed right but one prayer meeting when everyone started praying for him there was a loud snap and his hip was healed

A loud snap and no more bone problem! hurray!
And no one bothered to tell the part that happened the previous week, when he got a hip replacement... and that was the cause of the snap!
Or... wait for it... THAT NEVER HAPPENED!!

a woman at our church was bitten by an ant in her bed and the bite spread. when she went to the doctor he said there was no ant that could cause that huge of a rash.  the bite swelled and covered a lot of her arm.  she and others prayed for healing and the bite was gone within a week

Bitten by an ant (or some other small bug) and she got a rash from that... and a week later, it was healed!! The miracle of allergies!

my brother had a lott of warts on his hands that were causing a lot of pain and he had about 20 in all.  he tried all kinds of creams and ointments.  he was prayed for and overnight every single wart was gone with no sign they were ever there

I had a wart on a finger, once. I went to the doctor and she told me to put some acid on it and be careful to put some other cream around the wart, prior to applying the acid, so that the acid only acts on the wart. I bought the acid, and decided to try it on the following day. I wasn't too keen on that acid thing...

MIRACLE! The next day, my wart was completely gone!! Mind over matter! Fear got the better of that wart.

Your brother just got in the right mindset.

But you're 14... you're young... you've been brainwashed by your parents into believing all those miracle cures.
I ask you: Is there any story of regrowing limbs?

Oh... you're gone... too bad... enjoy your delusional life.

[Mister Agenda]

well its been great discussing with everyone i now understand your point of view a little more. 
i am a 14 year old pastors daughter and i know if i mentioned that earlier i probobally would have been shot down immediately. 
thank you for the discussions and i will be praying for all of you

Actually, we would probably have been easier on you, considering your tender age.

Thanks for taking the trouble to try to understand us. Many don't.