Alcohol 'more dangerous than heroin'

[theVOID]

Really, because i've taken it around 100 times, literally, and i'm none the worse for it, neither are the dozens of people who I know that have done the same (the entire psychedelic community)/

Not only that, but all of the major studies (you know the shit with evidence) found the same results.

C'mon then were is the shit with the evidence, cock. Hang on I can give you some.

http://www.thegooddrugsguide.com/lsd/dangers.htm

Did you read the first paragraph?



"LSD is non-toxic, has no known adverse physical after-effects other than fatigue and a lingering sensation of mind-expansion."

I can find you several studies on relative harm that place drug use lower than horse riding, football and stock car racing (to name a few), in terms of short term and long term physical impact on average, not to mention the massive gap between other substances like Alcohol and tobacco which are blatantly more harmful.

Also from your source: "Using LSD can't cause a person to become mentally ill"

Yeah mate, i'm going to get FUCKED UP on that acid huh? The relative dangers are miniscule to many of the perfectly reasonable recreational activities that exist.

I care, so do millions of other people who are threatened with persecution because a bunch of ignorant, historically motivated laws prevent me from smoking a joint after work while someone who has a few beers or a glass of wine is perfectly free to do so.

It's about double standards, and by definition they are unjustified.

Really, so taking drugs just equals good times. Yeah, yheah, drugs don't cause bad things to happen, people do. Dumb, fucking people.

Drugs =/= Harmful Drugs.
Some drugs are fun =/= All drugs are fun
Some drugs are safe relative to alcohol =/= all drugs are relatively safe alcohol.

If alcohol is permissible yet the drugs which are demonstrably less harmful are not, then we have a double standard, and that is something that by definition cannot be justified.

Maybe you'd be better off in a dictatorship.

No, its called the real World.

It sure is unfortunately, too many mindless fucks like you have a say in what happens.

[Autumnlicious]

Maybe in your little World. See the Government is on my side for the time being.

Whoop de doo - the gummint is on your side - it must be true!

Look people I really don't give a fuck what any of you think. The drugs are banned for a reason, becuase they are bad for you. Its not my fault people are so stupid they cannot control themselves.

Can we ban cars and alcohol yet? People do stupid things, so the rest of us must suffer.

If people were allowed to do as they pleased, what would the World be like? Where do you draw the line.

All powerful slippery slope attack!

Anyway, one way or another, I don't care, becuase I don't drink, smoke or take drugs, and no matter what the rest of you sheep think, I am better of without them, or you. And before you say well fuck off, unless I break the rules, I am free to stay, unless of course this is a authoritarian forum. ;-) Like that one did you.

If you don't care, then why are you opening your big fat mouth?

As I said all that shit will fuck you up.

So will alcohol, being ecstatic and sex. Don't see no ban there.

ok, I give in, you win. See the strange thing is, I have taken the position of legalising drugs before. I have the ability to change my mind. Don't you?

Just because you can change your mind doesn't validate your current assertions, which are either baseless, misinterpreted or irrelevant.

Really, I don't care if it changes or not. It dosen't affect me at all.

It only matters to you when you want it, and fuck everyone else, eh?

You know, you're begging for a "Fuck off".

... before you say well fuck off, unless I break the rules, I am free to stay, unless of course this is a authoritarian forum. ;-) Like that one did you.

So let me oblige you - Fuck off.

Like that, didn't you?

[Loki_999]

One of the most interesting things about LSD is... well, its like a box of chocolates, you never know what you are going to find.

Every trip is different and has different effects, unlike most drugs where the experience you will have is pretty predictable.

Of course the problem with this variety is you can't really mentally prepare yourself for what you will experience and therefore people will poor mental control are more likely to suffer a bad trip. A person with good mental control suffering a bad trip will simply say "Wait a moment, im on acid.... stop thinking about that and focus on something else"... bad trip will go to be replaced by something more interesting.

Its a problem for people trying it for the first time. If it is a good trip then the next time should be easier for them, but if its a bad trip then its probably going to put them off taking it for life.

I suspect those stories about idiots thinking they can fly while on LSD come from either a) first timers who did not take it in the company of good and reliable friends OR b) people who are taking so much they have lost all touch with reality. As I said before, you should take it responsibly or run the risk of your head flying away.

[ib.me.ub]

Like that, didn't you?

I did actually, thanks ;-).

@theVOID: From the same source;

Although LSD isn't physically addictive, regular users can become psychologically addicted. The fact that a trip can last for several hours and the individual will likely feel very tired after coming down means that the user may not be eating regularly or properly. A person who is tripping often may experience altered sleep patterns and neglect his or her personal hygiene.

As the psychological addiction progresses, the LSD user will likely neglect his or her personal relationships, too. The world they experience while under the influence of the drug becomes more interesting or perhaps less stressful than the reality of the user's "regular" life.

So, you probably should read past the first line.

Really though, how can flooding society with drugs be good thing.

[Jaysyn]

Like that, didn't you?

I did actually, thanks ;-).

@theVOID: From the same source;

Although LSD isn't physically addictive, regular users can become psychologically addicted. The fact that a trip can last for several hours and the individual will likely feel very tired after coming down means that the user may not be eating regularly or properly. A person who is tripping often may experience altered sleep patterns and neglect his or her personal hygiene.

As the psychological addiction progresses, the LSD user will likely neglect his or her personal relationships, too. The world they experience while under the influence of the drug becomes more interesting or perhaps less stressful than the reality of the user's "regular" life.

So, you probably should read past the first line.

Really though, how can flooding society with drugs be good thing.

And using the information you just provided, please explain why alcohol is legal & LSD is illegal.

Oh that's right, you can't.

[Tiberius]

Although LSD isn't physically addictive, regular users can become psychologically addicted. The fact that a trip can last for several hours and the individual will likely feel very tired after coming down means that the user may not be eating regularly or properly. A person who is tripping often may experience altered sleep patterns and neglect his or her personal hygiene.

As the psychological addiction progresses, the LSD user will likely neglect his or her personal relationships, too. The world they experience while under the influence of the drug becomes more interesting or perhaps less stressful than the reality of the user's "regular" life.

So, you probably should read past the first line.

Really though, how can flooding society with drugs be good thing.

So...no actual physical damage then? Exactly what theVOID was talking about. Alcohol leads to all sorts of physical ailments; as do cigarettes. LSD? Nada.

[ib.me.ub]

Are you trying to say that psychological damage is not a part of the equation. As the paragraph shows, psychological damage or becoming psychologically addicted will eventually lead to physical damage. Surely you can see the correlation.

[Tiberius]

It says nothing of psychological damage, other than the opposite of what you claim: "Using LSD can't cause a person to become mentally ill."

There is a difference between psychological damage, and psychological change. Does LSD change you psychologically? Yes (as a lot of drugs do, alcohol included). Does it cause psychological damage? No.

If you are trying to make the argument that LSD can cause people to change for the worse; I'm not going to disagree with you. However, a lot of things can have that effect, not all of them drug-related. Religion can have an adverse affect on you, but I'm not trying to ban religion (maybe you are, I have no idea). Having an argument can have an adverse affect on you, but we aren't trying to ban arguments.

The point is, at the end of the day, it should be down to personal choice. You say making all drugs legal will release them on the population; I say that will not be the case if they are regulated, and if enough people get education on them. I'm for the legalisation of drugs, but I certainly wouldn't try most of them, even if they were legal. The appeal just doesn't exist for me.

[ib.me.ub]

I commend you on your articulation, you would make a good politician.

[Skipper]

Really though, how can flooding society with drugs be good thing.

Society is already "flooded" with drugs. All the people who want to take them, do so already. All legalising would do is take the power and money out of dealers hands and put it back in to the governments, they could then use the funds to deal with the issues we already have due to drugs, despite currently having none of the benefits. As I agree with you, some drugs can be dangerous to the individual and the wider population, LSD not being one of them, as it is one of the least habit forming and least damaging substances available yet seen as terrible by ill informed, misdirected people.

Countries where drugs laws and attitudes have changed to a more accepting stance, Portugal and Holland being the notable two, user rates have actually fallen. Deaths have actually fallen and prison spaces are freed up due to less dealers wasting space for providing a substance to a generally willing and able user.

So legalising could, cut user rates, generate tax revenue, get rid of dealers, free up space in prisons for crimes where there actually is a victim and cut deaths from drugs.

I have followed and been involved in the movement for transforming the drug policy in the UK for a while and, I agree that with some substances we should be a bit more careful in our approach to legalising but I see no negatives for changing the law for the VAST majority of substances that are currently illegal. Weed, MDMA, Ecstasy, LSD are just a few of the substances that are far less harmful than alcohol and yet people are criminalised for choosing to take them instead of paying over the odds, destroying their livers and causing trouble in town centres every weekend.

Current drug policy CLEARLY dosen't work. I can't see the negatives on changing something that's so broken.