EU: Should the UK Leave or Stay?

[abaris]

You just worry about your own country.

Didn't I just say that the ignorance over the consequences runs rampant all over Europe? Quod erat demonstrandum, as they say.

[Edwardo Piet]

Let's be clear here. No one is saying that wanting to leave the EU is racist. Many people think that UKIP as a party are racist.

Exactly right. Thank you for putting it so much more concisely than I did.

I stand by the points I was making and the misrepresentation of myself but I will say the following:

I apologize to both Napo and Thumpy for being rather curt and tactless in my delivery. Turtle was in a bad mood and being a grumpy pants. I can do better.

[Edwardo Piet]

Let's be clear here. No one is saying that wanting to leave the EU is racist. Many people think that UKIP as a party are racist.

Ukip founder Alan Sked: 'The party has become a Frankenstein's monster'

Agreed... this thread is about a referendum not an election; people can want to leave the EU for all sorts of reasons... my dad for instance wants to leave because as an accountant he hates VAT and he votes UKIP. My point about the moderating influence of the EU over right wing parties was not meant to be a slur against anyone who wants to leave, just my opinion on the effect the EU has and what I want to preserve.

But on a side note, after having read that link, I personally wouldn't risk voting for UKiP if I changed my mind on the leaving question (which I could do... I'm not 100% certain on it though pretty sure at the moment), even if they did look good on paper (saying all the right things in their manifesto), just in case it is a masquerade.

I love all this so much, Squishy. One of the things I like about you so much is how thoroughly intellectually honest you are. You're as far from disingenuous as a person can get (the opposite of Humpy from Yes Minister, hehe). I agree that even if they do look good on paper it's not worth it as it could be a masquerade, and I am open to changing my mind about staying in the EU too, as I am always open to changing my mind Fantastic post.

[Edwardo Piet]

I feel like my views on this matter coincide greatly with Mathilda.

[Edwardo Piet]

http://youtu.be/QwrdDs0nmyg

"... the BBC tried to make him look stupid by like, letting him speak..."

"...he's just the voice of the average <BEEP>"

Wow LMAO that video was hilarious. I loved it so much how the guy managed to humorously feign being diplomatic in this "Well on the one hand he's this, and on the other hand he's that" kind of way like he was trying to be fair to him, when really he was expressing literally why he was a twat but his defenses of him were clearly ironic and sarcastic. LMAO that is such a hilarious sense of humor. Perfect satire.

[emjay]

I should have listened to my gut and stayed out of this thread... no good ever comes from talking about politics, just anger all round   Napo, what do you want me to say? I'm sorry you feel offended but I don't know how else I could have made my point.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Let's be clear here. No one is saying that wanting to leave the EU is racist. Many people think that UKIP as a party are racist.

Exactly right. Thank you for putting it so much more concisely than I did.

I stand by the points I was making and the misrepresentation of myself but I will say the following:

I apologize to both Napo and Thumpy for being rather curt and tactless in my delivery. Turtle was in a bad mood and being a grumpy pants. I can do better.

No one here owes me any apology. I don't have a dog in this fight and I'm here simply to get a little insight on the issue.

[Edwardo Piet]

Fair enough Thumpy, but even if you are not owed an apology, I felt better for giving you one

It's my curtness and tactlessness I apologize for, rather than my views and my being misrepresented by Napo, which I stand by. Regardless of if I offended you or not, Thumpy, I feel that I was curt and tactless even if you don't think I was, that's my opinion, and I feel I can do better and argue my point to people without being quite so blunt.

As reasonable as I was, I can be a lot more reasonable. The turtle can do better -- I was in a bad mood.

[emjay]

Fuck this. I think he's being disingenuous. Congratulations Napo, you've made yourself into a martyr when you were never even attacked. I'm done here.

[Edwardo Piet]

Yes that's totally what I'm suggesting you pea brained twat.

Serious you take me, yet I am not. Perhaps your a little to entrenched in your opinion. Perhaps missionary work is all your doing. If you wanna have a negotiation you need to at least be open to what the other side is trying to sell your and vise versa. Are you? 

Sounds to me like your arguing zealously anybody that will take the bait, even drunk Americans. And "listening" is secondary.

I agree, Goosebump.

Just one thing, learn the difference between "your" and "you're" and "to" and "too", I don't mean to be pedantic but after reading lots of your posts the grammar Nazis in my brain can't hold themselves in any longer