Atheism is impossible, I don't see how life can be created naturalistically.

[Minimalist]

are you one of those God screwed up my life

There is no 'god' to screw up anything.


What exists are people who think their fantasies give them the right to shove their doctrines down every one elses throats.

Do you get the difference?

"God" is irrelevant. Religion exists to the detriment of humanity.

[The Grand Nudger]

Do I need beliefs? I don't know, neither do you. What else can be said?

[Diamond-Deist]

Atheism has nothing to do with evolution, abiogenesis, or the big bang. If in fact our models for all three are incorrect, it still isn't evidence of a creator.

Magic is not a sufficient explanation for anything. So what if our understanding of how the universe came into existence is incomplete, or even wrong "the lawd did it" is still not an alternative explanation because it is fucking magic.

Ahh yes good answer but what if God is scientific in nature and not fairies and goblins and trolls (Chuck no one called your name), what if the real magic is in atoms, particles, protons, quasars.

God could be the universe in some weird all encompassing way, you have to admit the Universe is a weird place, it has order and disorder, creation and destruction .... it's a beautiful thing and is infinite, now if infinity is impossible to our senses what makes the possibility of a God so unbelievable, maybe he is the universe like we are star dust ... all one and the same?

---

are you one of those God screwed up my life

There is no 'god' to screw up anything.


What exists are people who think their fantasies give them the right to shove their doctrines down every one elses throats.

Do you get the difference?

"God" is irrelevant. Religion exists to the detriment of humanity.

Wow for the first time EVER we agree.

I studied history and literally saw the machine known as religion being made ..... and more importantly I know why, which is why I know it's an evil.

Sh*t sorry Nicholas, I was supposed to be defending you!!

[SleepingDemon]

Then why call it God?

[Diamond-Deist]

Then why call it God?

God can mean any sort of super power to all different people, all I know is this universe is to great to be just bricks and water however I do not believe in a Santa type God like mainstream religions.

Will has a lot to do with it, when observing nature the force of will is everywhere, from living things from forces in space .... this whole Universe is based on forces.

What is God, don't know but I believe if you want to know the mind of an artist or architect the next best thing is to study their work.

[The Grand Nudger]

That's "all you believe you know" to be more precise about it Diamond. At present, the notion that the universe is "bricks and water" is exactly the limit of what we do know. Knowledge isn't qualified by "what if". That would be conjecture.

[SleepingDemon]

But you still must make the foundational assumption that what you see is a creation. Billions of galaxies, billions of stars, a near infinite number of environmental permutations and so far as I we know, life only exists here. Where is the design? A short trip to the poles on this planet, or deserts, or anywhere off of it and you would find an environment hostile, and more often not, fatal to life.

The problem that you have, and the problem that you perpetuate is that regardless of your unsuccessful attempts to debunk natural explanations, you still don't justify the leap to intelligence other than by asking how else? We can't just fill in the blanks with whatever explanation we can create, we humans can imagine a great many catalysts, nome any more credible than another when evidence is not required.

[Diamond-Deist]

But you still must make the foundational assumption that what you see is a creation. Billions of galaxies, billions of stars, a near infinite number of environmental permutations and so far as I we know, life only exists here. Where is the design? A short trip to the poles on this planet, or deserts, or anywhere off of it and you would find an environment hostile, and more often not, fatal to life.

The problem that you have, and the problem that you perpetuate is that regardless of your unsuccessful attempts to debunk natural explanations, you still don't justify the leap to intelligence other than by asking how else? We can't just fill in the blanks with whatever explanation we can create, we humans can imagine a great many catalysts, nome any more credible than another when evidence is not required.

Ahh yes but think unfortunately for the Universe to work at all (even if it is just for us) you still need an entire Universe and all the rules and regulation that go along with it like gravity and rules of physics.

You can't just have a Sun, Moon and Earth then we'd know something's up, you need all the matter etc so you need stars, stars need nebula, nebula needs gases etc etc.

I think a lot of the real power in this universe is in the micro world, e.g what happens when you split an atom, you get an atom bomb, power is in the minuet.

What I'm saying is without this mysterious will I mention I don't think any of this is possible, where does it come from? what made the first cells drive for existence, sentient existence, what interest would a bit of element and chemicals have in being alive?

Something's going on, why would nothing decide to become something?

[The Grand Nudger]

We didn't need them, that's what we had. Cart before the horse. There is no veil between the large and the small, everything is made of "the power". Chemicals don't have "interests", that has to be about the strangest way I've ever heard this sentiment expressed.

[Diamond-Deist]

We didn't need them, that's what we had. Cart before the horse. There is no veil between the large and the small, everything is made of "the power". Chemicals don't have "interests", that has to be about the strangest way I've ever heard this sentiment expressed.

What I'm getting at is the microscopic interchanging of info which is both random and deliberate that lead to the forming of a cell, deliberate cannot come from a senseless act of a nothing object.

Finally because I have to go now, NASA themselves cannot figure out how the original cells went from inanimate to animate.

..... there must be a clue somewhere in modern cells surely, but hey I'm no specialist.