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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
August 20, 2019 at 12:32 pm
(August 20, 2019 at 1:21 am)Abaddon_ire Wrote: (August 19, 2019 at 10:04 pm)Lek Wrote: I don't think so. Belief in God gods has been pervasive in mankind as far back we can detect. It's not just a figment of someone's imagination. People imagine all kinds of things, but the majority of people from every corner of the world, have not embraced and carried on the belief in pink elephants.
FTFY.
Monotheism is the johnny come lately of faiths. Polytheism was the standard for a lot longer. And believed by far more people than your monotheism if argumentum ad populum is that important to you. So why are you not a polytheist?
I'm not a polytheist, but we share the same belief in a supernatural presence who created and has dominion over the natural universe. That's a huge similarity. By reading the remarks in this forum I can tell that atheists all have different ideas of the gods that they don't believe in, but they're all atheists.
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
August 20, 2019 at 3:40 pm
(August 20, 2019 at 12:32 pm)Lek Wrote: (August 20, 2019 at 1:21 am)Abaddon_ire Wrote: FTFY.
Monotheism is the johnny come lately of faiths. Polytheism was the standard for a lot longer. And believed by far more people than your monotheism if argumentum ad populum is that important to you. So why are you not a polytheist?
I'm not a polytheist, but we share the same belief in a supernatural presence who created and has dominion over the natural universe. That's a huge similarity. By reading the remarks in this forum I can tell that atheists all have different ideas of the gods that they don't believe in, but they're all atheists.
All of the thousands of claimed gods (including yours) have one thing in common. There exists no evidence for any of them.
In fact, you are almost an atheist yourself, because you believe in none of the thousands of claimed gods bar one. And you made that one up out of whole cloth.
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
September 9, 2019 at 4:42 am
(This post was last modified: September 9, 2019 at 6:10 am by Tom Fearnley.)
That which God is made of he did not create so God did not create everything. But in the Bible and the Quran it says "God created everything" so the Bible and Quran are wrong:
This subject really revolves around what God is made of. If he is made of minimal physics he did not create everything and we are talking about God#2 made of some non-matter. Can we come to a consensus? Either God is made of minimal physics or made of something we have no understanding of? How can minimal physics be intelligent without a brain or at least neurons etc? How can something made of something meaningless to us be intelligent?
I made three You Tube audio recordings on this topic, very sloppy overall but here they are:
1) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnoS_ciFblY&t=8s
2) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dRb3GcHuVU&t=28s
3) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldAo31Wnryc&t=333s
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
September 9, 2019 at 6:24 am
(This post was last modified: September 9, 2019 at 6:30 am by The Grand Nudger.)
It’s seems like we’re confusing archaeological evidence for religious beliefs with god’s pedigree. That would be an immense mistake.
100k ago we see burials. It’s not until 38k ago that we see zoomorphic ( and possibly anthropomorphic) figurines sometimes interpreted as god’s. Literal pink elephant territory.
35k ago we see people buried with “Venus figurines”....but the name suggests more than they imply.
Somewhere around 7k bc, the archaeligical record is littered with dildos and booby dolls, which probably wouldn’t suggest a devout believer in gods if we found them in your room today.
It’s only after that period that anything recognizably like a god pops up. 9k - 5k years ago. Not even close to how far back we can detect. A vanishing fraction.
Now, the sort of god you’re thinking if, Lek, is likely no older than you are. A pink elephant thats the contemporary incarnation of something that started out as a powerful ghost, became a member of a pantheon, shed the pantheon, and then shed it’s traditional attributes to fit your modern sensibilities.
One of my main points of criticism of god belief ( and the beliefs people have about god’s) is how woefully those beliefs misstate our origins, and their own....which is important for a factual and informative picture of human development.
That factual appraisal is inconvenient for the contention that god’s are as old as the hills, but the s the breaks.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
September 9, 2019 at 6:37 am
(This post was last modified: September 9, 2019 at 6:37 am by Belacqua.)
(September 9, 2019 at 4:42 am)Tom Fearnley Wrote: That which God is made of he did not create so God did not create everything.
What is God made of?
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
September 9, 2019 at 7:12 am
(This post was last modified: September 9, 2019 at 7:14 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Perhaps more to the point, is that anything more than an editing and continuity error in a story?
That god stuff, whatever that stuff is, is “uncreated” is baked into post axial god’s. No one has to know what that stuff is to know that the claim is made (and none of the claimants have ever known what that stuff is, either).
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
September 9, 2019 at 7:50 am
(This post was last modified: September 9, 2019 at 7:52 am by Tom Fearnley.)
(September 9, 2019 at 6:37 am)Belaqua Wrote: (September 9, 2019 at 4:42 am)Tom Fearnley Wrote: That which God is made of he did not create so God did not create everything.
What is God made of?
Either minimal physics or something that is meaningless to us. Either way he fails seemingly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeXJIhtT...e=youtu.be
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
September 9, 2019 at 7:54 am
(This post was last modified: September 9, 2019 at 7:55 am by Belacqua.)
(September 9, 2019 at 7:50 am)Tom Fearnley Wrote: (September 9, 2019 at 6:37 am)Belaqua Wrote: What is God made of?
Either minimal physics or something that is meaningless to us. Either way he fails seemingly.
I wonder what the people who have thought about these questions during the last few millennia said in answer to this question.
Have you looked in to this at all?
For example, Plato, Aristotle, Plotinus, Aquinas, Maimonides, Avicenna, Averroes... did they thing God was made of something?
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
September 9, 2019 at 8:32 am
(This post was last modified: September 9, 2019 at 8:34 am by The Grand Nudger.)
They certainly didn’t think it was made of nothing, lol.
Still, this is just trivia. If a story about me said I made myself but was born....it’s either speaking figuratively, or it suffers from poor editing. This is a literary dilemma, not an existential one that has some effect on the truth value of god claims.
Minimal physics, for example....only means something to us. Essence of being was popular when essence was the dominant semantics over physics. The way that we describe the composition of the divine changes as we change.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Is God a logical contradiction?
September 9, 2019 at 8:38 am
(September 9, 2019 at 7:54 am)Belaqua Wrote: (September 9, 2019 at 7:50 am)Tom Fearnley Wrote: Either minimal physics or something that is meaningless to us. Either way he fails seemingly.
I wonder what the people who have thought about these questions during the last few millennia said in answer to this question.
Have you looked in to this at all?
For example, Plato, Aristotle, Plotinus, Aquinas, Maimonides, Avicenna, Averroes... did they thing God was made of something?
No I don't think they have but it might be worth a try. That's a lot of research!
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