Irene of Athens: the Christian Byzantine Empress who gouged her own son's eyes.

[Astreja]

Restorative justice [link], which promotes reparations over vengeance, is vastly superior to punitive "make an example of the criminal" justice.

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No; I reject that rationalization.  The punishment must fit the crime and not surpass it, and taking away a living body part as retaliation for the loss of a non-living item is blatant injustice.

Always.

No. Fucking.  Exceptions.

And any society that permits such injustice is a society that deserves to fail so that it can be replaced by a more sane one.

The brain is a living organ just like your hands. If you cause a permanent trauma to it then the person ceases to function probably...

What part of "No. Fucking. Exceptions." did you not get, Winter?

Two wrongs do not make a right.  Imprison a criminal to keep them from harming someone else, yes.  Physically maim them, no.  To do so is a crime in itself.

[The Architect Of Fate]

The brain is a living organ just like your hands. If you cause a permanent  to it then the person ceases to function probably:

Your hand isn't an organ and that's a extremely unscientific view of trauma

In America alone, spending on keeping that organ away from permanent traumas & stigmas reached 225 billion $ in 2019 !!
Still, it is a society full of psychopaths and their mental health showed what level of apathy it reached in my civilization's encounter with them in 2003! the Japanese told similar stories of utter psychopathy about their ancestors.

Utter nonsense 

To each their view; but you can ask an African parent who got their daughter raped and killed about where they would prefer her attacker to be trailed: a country where they would be imprisoned for life -with a chance of parole- or an Islamic country where they would be hanged probably.

Then they have a backward and stunted view of justice based on emotions, not facts. It's a fact retributive justice doesn't lead to peace or closure but Restorative justice could

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Restorative justice [link], which promotes reparations over vengeance, is vastly superior to punitive "make an example of the criminal" justice.

---

The brain is a living organ just like your hands. If you cause a permanent trauma to it then the person ceases to function probably...

What part of "No. Fucking. Exceptions." did you not get, Winter?

Two wrongs do not make a right.  Imprison a criminal to keep them from harming someone else, yes.  Physically maim them, no.  To do so is a crime in itself.

Yup in every way Restorative justice is PROVEN to be superior by every metric that matters

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There is a reason the most peaceful and prosperous nations on earth also happen to be nations that treat prisoners well

[Astreja]

There is one major problem with irreversible punishments, such as amputating a limb or utilizing the death penalty:

What if the "criminal" was innocent? You can't restore the limb or the individual's life.

[Goosebump]

I don't think Winter is currently capable of being influenced by any power we here possess.

The economist J.K. Galbraith: “Faced with a choice between changing one’s mind and proving there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy with the proof.”

I think Winter believes, right or wrong, that he has found the "One" belief. He knows something *wink wink* that the rest of us don't get. He is part of a special class of people that know what is "really real". That belief is nearly synonymous with his identity/image of self. So having it challenged or examining it himself aren't things that exist for him. It simply is, just as surely as he is.

I think it would take something very traumatic, much like the punishments he defends, to happen to himself to shake that belief. Why arewethereyet's simple question is so impossible for him to answer, let alone really understand what is being asked.

EDIT: I did read the entire thread from the beginning. Not just dropping in to take a shit. Got some insomnia going, reading on a bright screen is probably not helping but rather than adjusting my behavior I'm rationalizing it. Sound familiar?

[The Grand Nudger]

In America alone, spending on keeping that organ away from permanent traumas & stigmas reached 225 billion $ in 2019 !!
Still, it is a society full of psychopaths and their mental health showed what level of apathy it reached in my civilisation's encounter with them in 2003 ! the Japanese told similar stories of utter psychopathy about their ancestors.

To each their view; but you can ask a an African parent who got their daughter raped and killed about where they would prefer her attacker to be trailed: a country where they would be imprisoned for life -with  a chance of parole- or an Islamic country where they would be hanged probably.

Technically, the japanese were told those stories by their government, to the point that they threw their children off of cliffs rather than let them be captured.  This gutted more than a few mothers who, then, found out that other mothers kids were alive and being treated very well as captives.  This is the reason you should just stick with mentioning your barbaric desires and urges, and leave history to people who read it.

[Goosebump]

In America alone, spending on keeping that organ away from permanent traumas & stigmas reached 225 billion $ in 2019 !!
Still, it is a society full of psychopaths and their mental health showed what level of apathy it reached in my civilisation's encounter with them in 2003 ! the Japanese told similar stories of utter psychopathy about their ancestors.

To each their view; but you can ask a an African parent who got their daughter raped and killed about where they would prefer her attacker to be trailed: a country where they would be imprisoned for life -with  a chance of parole- or an Islamic country where they would be hanged probably.

Technically, the japanese were told those stories by their government, to the point that they threw their children off of cliffs rather than let them be captured.  This gutted more than a few mothers who, then, found out that other mothers kids were alive and being treated very well as captives.  This is the reason you should just stick with mentioning your barbaric desires and urges, and leave history to people who read it.

Why do you persist? I ask because I too try to be as patient as possible. I just wonder why you use yours on something that you yourself have identified as analogous to a brick wall.

[The Grand Nudger]

Lost cause as an islamist, lost cause as a person, sure...but I think that even islamists and other assorted shitty people can learn something simple like historic trivia.

[Goosebump]

You made me laugh so that's worth something.

[Ahriman]

Lost cause as an islamist, lost cause as a person, sure...but I think that even islamists and other assorted shitty people can learn something simple like historic trivia.

Not all Muslims are shitty people

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Lost cause as an islamist, lost cause as a person, sure...but I think that even islamists and other assorted shitty people can learn something simple like historic trivia.

Not all Muslims are shitty people

Good thing no one said they were, then.

Boru