Good exists - a Catholic comments

[Ahriman]

Well I have evidence. Just not enough to prove my assumption is one hundred percent, undeniably true.

Do you have any plans to present your evidence ?

Yeah. We know some giraffes are birthed from a mother giraffe and don't just come out of nowhere. So that's evidence. It doesn't prove anything. But we can be reasonably sure where giraffes come from, based on that evidence.

[Bucky Ball]

Do you have any plans to present your evidence ?

Yeah. We know some giraffes are birthed from a mother giraffe and don't just come out of nowhere. So that's evidence. It doesn't prove anything. But we can be reasonably sure where giraffes come from, based on that evidence.

You are correct. It doesn't prove anything.

[Ahriman]

Yeah. We know some giraffes are birthed from a mother giraffe and don't just come out of nowhere. So that's evidence. It doesn't prove anything. But we can be reasonably sure where giraffes come from, based on that evidence.

You are correct. It doesn't prove anything.

Would you be willing to stand in front of a group of scientists and say, "Giraffes might come from nowhere, because we haven't observed the birth of every giraffe in existence"......?

[arewethereyet]

>Patiently waiting for a giraffe to just go poof and appear in my living room.

[The Grand Nudger]

You are correct. It doesn't prove anything.

Would you be willing to stand in front of a group of scientists and say, "Giraffes might come from nowhere, because we haven't observed the birth of every giraffe in existence"......?

The central claim of creationist belief.

[Mister Agenda]

The 'in our hearts' nonsense reminds me of the fake polygraph story that christians like to tell. It goes like this: When hooked to a polygraph an atheist is asked if god exists or if they believe in god. When the atheist responds 'no' the polygraph indicates that they are lying.

Telling this story only demonstrates the desperation present in some christians.

There was a study, in Finland in 2014, but the error bars are too high (polygraphs are notoriously unreliable) and there wasn't a proper control group, IMHO. The atheists were asked to state things like 'I wish my parents would drown' and 'I dare God to drown my parents'. More anxiety was indicated over the second kind of statement. A more complete study would have tried out similar phrases on another group of atheists, like 'I dare Odin to drown my parents' or 'I dare the faeries to steal my child' or 'I dare Great Cthulhu to devour my entire family'.

I couldn't find a study that just asked atheists 'do you believe God is real' while hooked to a polygraph.

[brewer]

The 'in our hearts' nonsense reminds me of the fake polygraph story that christians like to tell. It goes like this: When hooked to a polygraph an atheist is asked if god exists or if they believe in god. When the atheist responds 'no' the polygraph indicates that they are lying.

Telling this story only demonstrates the desperation present in some christians.

There was a study, in Finland in 2014, but the error bars are too high (polygraphs are notoriously unreliable) and there wasn't a proper control group, IMHO. The atheists were asked to state things like 'I wish my parents would drown' and 'I dare God to drown my parents'. More anxiety was indicated over the second kind of statement. A more complete study would have tried out similar phrases on another group of atheists, like 'I dare Odin to drown my parents' or 'I dare the faeries to steal my child' or 'I dare Great Cthulhu to devour my entire family'.

I couldn't find a study that just asked atheists 'do you believe God is real' while hooked to a polygraph.

The story indicated that the question was asked during job intervue polygraphs. 

https://thedailyhatch.org/2014/06/04/csi...ef-in-god/

[Mister Agenda]

Hi Ahriman,
I’m still getting used to the chat lines, but it seems we are both on same page about Angrboda. Science provides no answer to the actual beginning of the universe. Indeed the more we discover the more amazing we can say is the world God made. 
God bless 
Barry

Your ignorance is not my problem.  FWIW, I suspect something along the lines of Hawking-Hartle is likely.  It at least is more substantial than magic.

But while we're at it, your answer requires that there be a temporal boundary in the past.  Prove it or shut up.

The math works and it doesn't contradict any known laws of physics. That's more than 'it was magic' has going for it.

[Mister Agenda]

Actually, the decay of Carbon 14 to Nitrogen 14 "just happens".

And? A giraffe doesn't "just happen", the giraffe atoms didn't just randomly coalesce into the form of a giraffe out of nowhere for no goddamn reason at all.

LinuxGal's point was that there are things that 'just happen'. It's impossible to predict when a Carbon 14 atom will decay, because it isn't caused by anything. Giraffes are a completely different thing. Just because some things 'just happen' doesn't imply that everything 'just happens'.

[Bucky Ball]

You are correct. It doesn't prove anything.

Would you be willing to stand in front of a group of scientists and say, "Giraffes might come from nowhere, because we haven't observed the birth of every giraffe in existence"......?

No sweetie, I wouldn't. You MISSED the point entirely. Are giraffes "beings" on the Quantum level ?
As usual, most of this shit just flies WAY over your head.
Generalizing all Reality from giraffes, is the ignorant use of a false analogy.
I'm not sure you're capable of it, but I hope you can get yourself an education some day.