Writings during the lifetime of Jesus?

[Minimalist]

That is why it is so important for modern fundie fools to try to breathe life back into the testimoniam flavianum. Even though it was dismissed as "a rank forgery" by bishop Wharburton in the 18th century later xtians (correctly) feel the lack of ancient historical reference to their boy is a serious problem for them. Thus, they anoint Josephus as authentic because they are so desperate to feel that their fairy tales are real.

[LastPoet]

If my point of view was so fucked up that I needed to spin everything around to fit reality into my delusion, I'd prefer to cap myself than to waste my credibility and honesty trying to look thoughtfull.

Some people can't see that.

[spockrates]

Yes, during the life of Jesus. I have already looked into the writings you mentioned, spockrates, but thanks for posting them anyway.

No problem! Can't think of any while he was still living. That would be quite a find, since he lived in obscurity up until the last three years if his life.

I don't think the lack of writing prior to a person's death is necessarily a deal breaker. For example, there is no writing about Socrates prior to his death. But that does not prevent me from discounting the writings of Xenophon, or Socrates disciple Plato as fairy tales!

[Gambit]

I recognize I'm not breaking any new ground here; however, we're talking about the supposed savior of the human race, the living God and most important figure in all of history. We are told there were multitudes who witnessed his miracles, yet not one of them was able to record in writing that which they witnessed. I guess it goes back to the old adage - extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. The problem I have is: Not only is there a lack of extraordinary evidence, the evidence we do have is either hearsay or forgery.

Contrary to what some of the theists on this site may believe, I have opened my heart to god and believed 100% that such an entity existed, however, I felt nothing of its existence. All I had was a belief, nothing more. I've since tried searching for God, hoping that I had missed something and the path would become clear. Again, there was nothing. In fact, I'd probably say the opposite was true. The more I learned about the supposed nature of God(s), the less I believed in their existence.

[downbeatplumb]

No problem! Can't think of any while he was still living. That would be quite a find, since he lived in obscurity up until the last three years if his life.

I don't think the lack of writing prior to a person's death is necessarily a deal breaker. For example, there is no writing about Socrates prior to his death. But that does not prevent me from discounting the writings of Xenophon, or Socrates disciple Plato as fairy tales!

But the accounts of Socrates , Xenophon and Plato are about men and not about supposed gods.

Do you realise why these claims attract the need for evidence other than hearsay.

Its the difference in me saying "I saw Brian down the bus stop" and "I saw Brian lift up a bus using only his left arm, right over his head"
One claim is mundane and so is believable the other is an extradinary claim and requires extradinary proof.

Oh and if your story reads like a fairy tale you cant really blame people for pointing it out.

[LastPoet]

I don't think the lack of writing prior to a person's death is necessarily a deal breaker. For example, there is no writing about Socrates prior to his death. But that does not prevent me from discounting the writings of Xenophon, or Socrates disciple Plato as fairy tales!

Sure, as long you wish to believe it hard enough, anything and everything will do to justify said belief.

To some of us, that isn't enough. You are forgetting something important (or purposedly forgetting IMO): Socrates and Xenophon do not claim to have supernatural powers, all writings about them are about philosopphy, something at the grasp of the most simple of humans. Remember that!

[Minimalist]

That would be quite a find, since he lived in obscurity up until the last three years if his life.

Again, you (probably deliberately) miss the point. It doesn't matter if your boy was ALIVE....what matters is that there were other writers who were ALIVE and did not hear of him.

You are giving us the classic xtian paradox. At one and the same time you insist that he was a fucking nobody that no one paid any attention to BUT he was also so fucking dangerous that the High Priests had to break every rule in the fucking book to hold a trial on Passover. Make up your mind.

A writer, like Philo, who died c 50 AD and commented extensively on Jewish affairs, never heard of a condemned criminal who came back to life and was hailed as the fucking messiah in Philo's own lifetime? Grow up.

[spockrates]

I don't think the lack of writing prior to a person's death is necessarily a deal breaker. For example, there is no writing about Socrates prior to his death. But that does not prevent me from discounting the writings of Xenophon, or Socrates disciple Plato as fairy tales!

Sure, as long you wish to believe it hard enough, anything and everything will do to justify said belief.

To some of us, that isn't enough. You are forgetting something important (or purposedly forgetting IMO): Socrates and Xenophon do not claim to have supernatural powers, all writings about them are about philosopphy, something at the grasp of the most simple of humans. Remember that!

So are you saying, LP that if the writers of the New Testament never claimed Jesus did things you and I find impossible to do, you really wouldn't have a problem believing in him?

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That would be quite a find, since he lived in obscurity up until the last three years if his life.

Again, you (probably deliberately) miss the point. It doesn't matter if your boy was ALIVE....what matters is that there were other writers who were ALIVE and did not hear of him.

You are giving us the classic xtian paradox. At one and the same time you insist that he was a fucking nobody that no one paid any attention to BUT he was also so fucking dangerous that the High Priests had to break every rule in the fucking book to hold a trial on Passover. Make up your mind.

A writer, like Philo, who died c 50 AD and commented extensively on Jewish affairs, never heard of a condemned criminal who came back to life and was hailed as the fucking messiah in Philo's own lifetime? Grow up.

I'd say I was careless, rather than deliberate, but your criticism is valid. I indeed did not understand the opening post and appreciate the correction.

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My ex (For the 50th time) is trying to keep me out of our unborn child's life because she believes in the existence of Jesus and his divinity, however, I have serious doubts. ...

If it is none of my business, please say so. In what way is your ex trying to keep you out of the unborn child's life?

[Gambit]

She is basically saying that if I do not believe and conform to the practices of her belief then I will not be in the child's life.

[Napoléon]

So are you saying, LP that if the writers of the New Testament never claimed Jesus did things you and I find impossible to do, you really wouldn't have a problem believing in him?

What difference would it make.

He wouldn't be 'the son of god' in that case and we wouldn't have all you bible bashers running around then would we.

You really do ask such tedious and ignorant questions.