Ordinary vs fundamentalist Christian

[fr0d0]

I think the people we are talking about are more extremist than fundamentalist. I find nothing fundamental in claiming extreme views and holding to them irrationally. I think for serious Islamic scholars the term "Muslim fundamentalist" is the most abhorrent contradiction of their beliefs. Extremists are claiming superior understanding of the basic belief, which is logically absurd.

[dry land fish]

Ordinary Christians go to church and do their praying and mind their own business. They will pray for their neighbor that always has an pile of empty beer boxes sitting beside their garbage can on trash pickup day but they won't say anything to their face. They aren't too bad. I live next to some christians and they have never bothered me.

Catholics can't say anything,as they often have as many empty beer bottles as any neighbour. Well,our house always did.


Although not a believer at the time (my wife was ) I happily attended the "St Paul's Parish Annual Men's International Beer Tasting Evening" and got shitfaced for $15.The cost included eleventy two REAL sammies made by BLOKES! Several of the priests from the local monastery attended as guests,as did the Archbishop,who only got a little legless. (IE staggered but did not actually fall down) The priests got paralytic,a time honoured tradition with Catholic priests and free piss. I kid you not. Only time in my life I've ever rolled UP a hill on the way home


An explanation on intoxication: According to my dad,there are three levelsrunk (you fall down) VERY drunk (you can't get up) and dead drunk (you're unconscious) ME? I think you're drunk when you feel sophisticated but can't pronounce it.

Catholics are a different breed of Christian. Catholics don't seem to bother those that aren't Catholic. I have yet to have a Catholic come to me and try to make me take a Bible. They want to rule their members and force everyone who marries a Catholic person to become a member of the church. They then force them to make their children attend and this keeps their numbers up. They vote...but the Catholics I know voted for the casinos in KY and they vote for all of the wet issues in our counties. You know some KY counties prohibit alcohol sales? The Baptists want to keep it dry. I have a problem with Catholics because they do whatever the Pope tells them to do but I've never had one personally bother me. I have had Baptists, holy rollers, Jehovas Witnesses, and other crazy off the wall christian people to approach me and harass me.

[beenthere]

I would think that fundamentalism is when theists will never shift from their belief regardless. As - I think it was - Kurt Wise who said how he would never shift from his belief in God even if all the evidence in the world turned against creationism. I haven't got TGD with me atm as I'm on public comp, I think it was him though... but anyway - fundamentalism=sticking with the fundamentals no matter what I would have thought. Or at least that attitude if they in fact lost their faith, that wouldn't mean they weren't a fundamentalist. It's simply I think that - fundamentalism is this attitude of never shifting from their belief, it's absolutely fundamental, regardless of reasoning and evidence. And this is self-admitted.

EvF

You are pretty much on target. I was born into Fundalmentalism and it took me more than half of my life-time to crawl out from under it's grip. Fundamentalism was so indocrinated into my being that for a long time, it was WHO I WAS. My questions were squashed. My life was controled. The preacher was 2nd only to the "word of god". I had to struggle to reinvent myself. When I accomplised that, I truely found my real self and was at peace.

I know many people who can't hear anything remotely argumentive about their Fundamentalist religion because it is who they are. They are defined by it and find a great comfort in its demanding control of their lives. The fellowship with like-minded people keeps them going back for more.

In a "nut-shell", fundamnetalism might be defined as having members who are certain that they are the "true religion" and can not be swayed from that belief no matter what sane argument is put before them. They also need to convert, convert, convert.

[fr0d0]

fundamentalism is this attitude of never shifting from their belief, it's absolutely fundamental, regardless of reasoning and evidence. And this is self-admitted.

Hmm.. seems to describe the view of some atheists here too

[Edwardo Piet]

What belief?

And I (amongst many atheists here I think?) self-admittedly announce that I will only change my mind if the evidence changes. It's completely opposite to not changing your mind regardless of evidence!!

Fundamentalism, as I defined above is:

1. Having a belief or beliefs.

2. Admitting that you won't shift from the above regardless of if the evidence goes against it.

I, amongst many other atheists here:

1. Have a mere disbelief. Atheism is not a belief (excluding gnostic atheism).

2. Say that I/they will change my/their mind if the evidence changes.

It's the opposite. Unless you're only referring to the explicitly gnostic atheists here - but even they don't tend to announce that they wouldn't change if the evidence did, they just consider it impossible because they consider God impossible!

EvF

[Retorth]

I second that, Evie.

I definitely will change my mind if infallible evidence is shown to me. I would have to change my mind anyway because the evidence would be right before me, undeniable.

[fr0d0]

I was aware of the get out with the word belief, but expected you to be able to see past that, and kept it to preserve the quote.

It's fundamentalist to say you will only 'believe' given evidence, seeing that 'evidence' is not required. This you well know. What you're really saying is that you will definitely not ever change your mind and this is the fake reason you offer for that stance. Own your own position. Don't deny it using false statements.

[Violet]

Everything we 'know' is but belief, because it is assumed... All of our beliefs are assumed by us to be true. <--Existentialist

[Edwardo Piet]

[quote='fr0d0' pid='32302' dateline='1252610334']
I was aware of the get out with the word belief, but expected you to be able to see past that, and kept it to preserve the quote.

I can't argue about evidence Vs faith here, so I will just comment on a section of your post.

[quote]What you're really saying is that you will definitely not ever change your mind and this is the fake reason you offer for that stance. Own your own position. Don't deny it using false statements.
[/quote]

No because that's a complete misrepresentation of what I said above. I said I will change my mind if there's...you know what, it begins with E...I can't discuss this here.

I am not saying I won't change my mind, that I won't shift from my belief. I am not saying that at all - so it's not fundamentalism as I defined it above.

EvF

[fr0d0]

So are you saying that faith demands evidence? This is literally contradictory and is a nonsense.

You are using a weak excuse to not think about it. Your mind is set. You will not change it.

What evidence would you accept? - you cannot produce any possible example