Biblical illiteracy

[Silver]

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/365...vid-french

It’s Imperative that Christians Use Explicitly Biblical Arguments

Over time, and with the benefit of experience, I came to utterly reject the notion that I should only talk about cultural, economic, or political issues without reference to the Bible.

First, America isn’t secular. The vast majority of Americans are still Christian, and even those Christians who don’t have an orthodox view of scriptural inerrancy still view the Bible as their faith’s authoritative text.

Second, as the product of divine inspiration, it’s words are far better — more life-giving — than anything I can dream up with human wisdom. Telling a Christian not to use the Bible is like asking a lawyer to win a case without reference to his best available precedent.

Third, those people who so often assure you that the Bible isn’t persuasive usually have no idea what the Bible says about virtually anything. Biblical illiteracy is a culture-wide problem, and confident assertions that the Bible has nothing meaningful to say on any given issue are typically the confident assertions of the ignorant.

From my experience, most atheists are quite biblically literate, and it is their knowledge of precisely what the fictional book has to impart that strengthens their atheism.

I know that I have used the term before, but it still applies. Christians merely wear rose-colored glasses while reading it. If those rose-colored glasses were removed, they would most likely no longer be theists.

[Esquilax]

The trouble you'll so often find is that christians will very quickly accuse us atheists of not knowing or understanding the bible, when what they actually mean is that we don't share their specific reading of X passage, or Y commandment. It's not a matter of lack of knowledge, it's just that calling someone stupid or ignorant is easier than supporting your position when you run into a disagreement.

Really, this biblical illiteracy stuff is just symptomatic of this immense christian ego: "You and I disagree on this bible stuff, and I can't possibly be wrong, and so you must just not know what you're talking about. It's really the only possibility."

[Minimalist]

Oh...National Review. Yeah...jesus freaks in abundance there...at least when they need a few votes for republicunts.

[Jacob(smooth)]

In fairness, I tend to find both atheists and Christians have a skewed knowledge.

Christians tend to be knowledgeable about the fluffy bits and the bits which support their pre existing beliefs. For eg they might quote you chapter and verse on the passages on homosexuality but be more hazy on the bits about helping the poor (communism )

Whereas a lot of atheist s I know can quote me the top 5 contradictions but are unaware of the bits promoting equality or integrity.

As I've said before, it's a verbal rorscarch.

[Rayaan]

Christians tend to be knowledgeable about the fluffy bits and the bits which support their pre existing beliefs. For eg they might quote you chapter and verse on the passages on homosexuality but be more hazy on the bits about helping the poor (communism )

Whereas a lot of atheist s I know can quote me the top 5 contradictions but are unaware of the bits promoting equality or integrity.

Speaking of Biblical literacy, I think that Christians are especially hazy on the numerous 'Jesus is God' bits, which is the core and one of the most essential concepts for Christians to understand.

Do you agree with that, Jacob?

[Jacob(smooth)]

Christians tend to be knowledgeable about the fluffy bits and the bits which support their pre existing beliefs. For eg they might quote you chapter and verse on the passages on homosexuality but be more hazy on the bits about helping the poor (communism )

Whereas a lot of atheist s I know can quote me the top 5 contradictions but are unaware of the bits promoting equality or integrity.

Speaking of Biblical literacy, I think that Christians are especially hazy on the numerous 'Jesus is God' bits, which is the core and one of the most essential concepts for Christians to understand.

Do you agree with that, Jacob?

Trinitarianism is certainly one of the more difficult concepts to understand, not least because it's not "like" anything. The analogies used, like sides of a dice or states of water do not, I think, represent the reality very well.

I wouldn't want to venture an opinion on what are the most essential concepts for a Christian to understand. Who am I to judge? Speaking personally, I wouldn't say it's at the core of my faith. One of my closest friend is a jehovahs witness and we've been arguing about the divinity of Jesus for 10 years. To me she exhibits all the significant" fruits of the spirit" so I would not opine that here doctrinal differences on this strongly affect her Christianity.

[Zazzy]

I took theology in high school because it was required, but that was about a hundred years ago. I know squat about the bible other than the major stories and the beautiful parts, like the psalms of David.

I am often amazed at how well the atheists here know the bible. Does most of that come from having been a Christian, or from deconverting?

[Psykhronic]

Seems to vary, some of us read the bible because might as well see what people believe, others were formerly christians or decided to look into religion and found they could not believe, etc. A college roommate of mine was going for confirmation because her family wanted her to, but she decided to read the bible first because she thought, personally, that was a really important stepping stone to confirmation. She read it, and could not understand why anyone would believe it and told her family she could not go through with confirmation.

[ThomM]

In fairness, I tend to find both atheists and Christians have a skewed knowledge.

Christians tend to be knowledgeable about the fluffy bits and the bits which support their pre existing beliefs. For eg they might quote you chapter and verse on the passages on homosexuality but be more hazy on the bits about helping the poor (communism )

Whereas a lot of atheist s I know can quote me the top 5 contradictions but are unaware of the bits promoting equality or integrity.

As I've said before, it's a verbal rorscarch.

Yes - but there should NOT be contradictions - not obvious inequities in the bible if it was INSPIRED by an all knowing "god". THe message should be constant - complete - coherent - and consistent - and it is NOT in any way.
There should be NO factual errors as well. WE would not expect an all knowing god to NOT know the makeup of the universe. And the book is all over the place when it comes to moral issues.

The fact that the bible supports Slavery alone is a reason to reject it as a source - since it is not just small things that are contradictory - but in major moral issues.

Why should slavery be addresses as something other than WRONG?
Why are there instruction in the correct way to sell your daughter into slavery?
Why should someone be happy to bash the heads of little ones to rocks?
Why is it that you can normally contradict a quote from the bible - with another quote from the bible.

IF the god does not tempt - then why did the god ask Abraham to MURDER his son?

Why did the god MURDER ordinary Egyptians during the passover for something they had NOTHING to do with?

IF the devil took the christ to a high place from where he could see all the kingdoms of the world - And it is NOT claimed in the bible to be a vision - then the bible says something that CANNOT be true - our earth is a sphere and it would not be possible to see all of the kingdoms mentioned in the bible alone from one high place.

WHy is the bible so anti - female. Not just the old testament - but how about 1 Timothy 2 - where is clearly says that woman should be silent - and submissive to men - and hold no authority or teach men. THEY must bear children to be saved? Have you ever had a female teacher - and why was that allowed?

Religions accept that infants and children must reach an age of reason and responsibility before they can sin - where did the god SAVE all of the babies and infants and children who had not yet done anything wrong - in the great flood - Sodom and Gomorrah. Why does the bible SPECIFICALLY mention the killing of children in other places? YOU cannot say they WOULD have sinned - since FREE WILL says that they could have changed their minds

Speaking of free will - if it does exist - then we MUST have the ability to choose to do something that the god does not already know - which would of course means that a god could NOT be all knowing to allow freedom o choice. Example - it a god "knows" i will sin - thousands of years before I was born - AM I FREE to choose not to when I am alive and actually make the decision - can I therefore VIOLATE the "all knowing" of the god.

Sorry but the problem is that studies have shown that it is atheists who actually know more about the bible - and it is because we have actually read it. And it is NOT just 5 contradictions that make the problem.

THe fact is - the bible is a book of the myths and legends and fiction of ancient superstitious goat herders and cave dwellers - and should not be read by children.

[Jacob(smooth)]

And hello to you.

Some somewhat off topic points there old boy. The thread is about how well people know the book, not Whether the should bother.

But I'm interested by this comment :-


"Sorry but the problem is that studies have shown that it is atheists who actually know more about the bible - and it is because we have actually read it. "

Citation please.