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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:23 pm
(This post was last modified: October 10, 2014 at 6:23 pm by Bad Wolf.)
The reason you give for not liking abortion is the fact that foetuses are human beings and we are not allowing them to live, but your definition doesn't even distinguish between foetuses and fingernails, shouldn't you be equally outraged when we cut our fingernails?
(October 10, 2014 at 6:22 pm)ShaMan Wrote: You've misconstrued my question. It's sincere and it stands on its own. If Chas and I have differing definitions of what a 'being' is (and I suspect that we do) then the terms must first be defined before conversation can proceed. It's a logical truth.
And he asked first, which means you should answer first.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:25 pm
(October 10, 2014 at 6:22 pm)ShaMan Wrote: (October 10, 2014 at 6:12 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: He asked first. Stop being obnoxious. You've misconstrued my question. It's sincere and it stands on its own. If Chas and I have differing definitions of what a 'being' is (and I suspect that we do) then the terms must first be defined before conversation can proceed. It's a logical truth.
A human being requires a brain and nervous system. A fetus does not have either until after six months of gestation.
Prior to that, the fetus does not have the attributes of a being.
Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:27 pm
Since people can't read words through their pre-determined filter of projection, and prefer instead to argue, I will define what I consider to be a "being" so as to eliminate any confusion from my end. A "being" according to my experience is any living thing that comes into 'being'. Since a human embryo has, come into being, and is made from Human DNA, it is therefore, according to my experience, a Human being.
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:28 pm
So again my fingernail is a human being by your definition because it has human DNA
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:30 pm
(October 10, 2014 at 6:28 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: So again my fingernail is a human being by your definition because it has human DNA I said any living thing that comes into being. Your fingernail is dead tissue.
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:31 pm
(October 10, 2014 at 6:27 pm)ShaMan Wrote: Since people can't read words through their pre-determined filter of projection, and prefer instead to argue, I will define what I consider to be a "being" so as to eliminate any confusion from my end. A "being" according to my experience is any living thing that comes into 'being'. Since a human embryo has, come into being, and is made from Human DNA, it is therefore, according to my experience, a Human being.
Your experience.
How many fetuses have you experienced walking, talking, interacting, thinking, ... ?
Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:32 pm
My foot is alive, is that a human being?
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:45 pm
(October 10, 2014 at 6:32 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: My foot is alive, is that a human being? Excellent! Yes, it is Human, attached to a being that is made of Human materials. We Humans are keen on saying "My foot" and "My hand" when in fact all of our body is part of the entity that each of us calls "I" or "me" which is indeed all Human.
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:46 pm
So should it be illegal for me to chop off my own foot? Should there be laws in place to prevent me from doing so?
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: Abortion not allowed
October 10, 2014 at 6:47 pm
(This post was last modified: October 10, 2014 at 6:49 pm by ShaMan.)
(October 10, 2014 at 6:31 pm)Chas Wrote: Your experience.
How many fetuses have you experienced walking, talking, interacting, thinking, ... ? I'm speaking of "being" which transcends walking and talking, which are actually "doing" and not "being". That is why I was adamant about the definition of "being" a few posts back - I was trying to avoid this exact misunderstanding.
(October 10, 2014 at 6:46 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: So should it be illegal for me to chop off my own foot? Should there be laws in place to prevent me from doing so? It's called self-mutilation and it's considered a mental illness. The law imposes sanctions on mentally ill people, including longer hospitalization (sentences) for repeat offenders.
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