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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:40 am
(December 17, 2014 at 10:01 am)thesummerqueen Wrote: This isn't a growing trend. It's simply that it SEEMS to be growing because people are being more and more vocal about it, and bringing visibility to it. It's a problem that has existed since internet anonymity allowed any two-bit troll with an internet connection to spout his/her nonsense on the internet. Agreed. Just odd to see 20 somethings (or maybe 30) who identify themselves as rationalists, do some things similar as the people they oppose.
(December 17, 2014 at 10:03 am)Alex K Wrote: I've heard of such things as well. That's classical sexism in my book, and it is probably not related to atheism. It is a known phenomenon in tech conferences for example. Even Hollywood writers are encouraged not to give too much important dialogue to women characters because audiences "stop paying attention".
Question to you: in which sense should we as atheists do something about that? Who is in a position to do something? As someone attending, one might try to speak up. Organizers? Organizers barely help. Almost always all male and least interested. The last time I was told this isn't about "Feelings" its about "Freedom" and "Rationality".
(December 17, 2014 at 10:26 am)Alex K Wrote: So, in the future, if you bring up these kinds of problems as criticism, it's probably important to clarify what exactly you mean such that atheists who do not or do not wish to identify with any of these existing groups don't shoot at you for misrepresenting them. Well all said and done I don't think I got an answer, except go somewhere else. Is there a way to make these vocal atheist movements more inclusive? Or it'd be great if someone could direct me any such one too.
If they can get together make religion and women jokes, further claim to be rationalist and skeptic, is asking for a little responsibility too much?
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:42 am
(December 17, 2014 at 10:40 am)SoFarEast Wrote: (December 17, 2014 at 10:01 am)thesummerqueen Wrote: This isn't a growing trend. It's simply that it SEEMS to be growing because people are being more and more vocal about it, and bringing visibility to it. It's a problem that has existed since internet anonymity allowed any two-bit troll with an internet connection to spout his/her nonsense on the internet. Agreed. Just odd to see 20 somethings (or maybe 30) who identify themselves as rationalists, do some things similar as the people they oppose.
Intellectually, it is odd. Practically, not so much - people like to identify themselves as all sorts of things while maintaining severe cognitive biases.
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:44 am
(December 17, 2014 at 9:48 am)SoFarEast Wrote: I just happen to be a part of a deeply religious country, where coming out in the open is very difficult. I won't deny the misogyny of my fellow atheists here, is probably remnants of misogyny of our national culture, but I really hope when we turned that things would be different.
I hope that can explain my skewed opinion. As such a lot of people here look up to Dawkins and Harris, and I hoped they'd set a better example.
Where do you live? Knowing this would go a long in giving context to the observations you shared.
Are you studying in your home country? I'm trying to make sense of the reported difficulty of being open about your disbelief, but yet have the opportunity to attend atheist conferences as well as encountering atheists at university.
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:46 am
(December 17, 2014 at 10:31 am)robvalue Wrote: Why didn't you bring up what actually happened 9 pages ago instead of these vague accusations against atheism? Well I told you I could let you know my personal experiences. You didn't want to hear them.
(December 17, 2014 at 10:31 am)robvalue Wrote: Never mind. If you are for real (and I'm still not totally convinced) then yes, I'm sure we all are disgusted by that kind of behaviour. I'm not sure what else you want us to do though? We're not going to go on a twitter hate campaign against some random name you give us. We can help you lodge a formal complaint or something against them, if you would like to do that. I've lodged a complaint myself. That's not what I want. I thought it was something specific to here, but I can see instances in many places. You can tell me Dawkins is Dawkins, he's no leader. But he does matter. There's no denying that.
I'm not specifically asking you to do something, like a twitter campaign or a complaint. I thought this was a problem that was not being noticed, and it's good to know people are sensitive to it. I was also curious if measures are being taken to prevent it.
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:47 am
(December 17, 2014 at 3:15 am)SoFarEast Wrote: Hello.
I've observed a growing trend in public interactions and online spaces in the way atheists behave. Bullying women, insulting gays, alienating anyone who doesn't subscribe to nerd culture. Is the lack of humanistic principles in Atheism leading to cult behavior? Or what else explains this?
It may not be a religion, but most atheists behave exactly like members of organized religion. Sorry if this has been brought up before. It's a worrying trend. A lot of late teen, early 20 atheists I've met won't think twice before using 'cunt' or 'faggot', or other such forms merciless insulting.
not a cult nor a religion just a way of live not believing in god due to the lack of evidence of a creator or a god type figure.
Atheism is a non-prophet organization join today.
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:49 am
(This post was last modified: December 17, 2014 at 10:54 am by Alex K.)
(December 17, 2014 at 10:46 am)SoFarEast Wrote: I'm not specifically asking you to do something, like a twitter campaign or a complaint. I thought this was a problem that was not being noticed, and it's good to know people are sensitive to it. I was also curious if measures are being taken to prevent it.
Oh, I don't know where on the internets you are active, but many people are noticing like hell. You might start talking to these ladies http://skepchick.org/
(December 17, 2014 at 10:47 am)dyresand Wrote: not a cult nor a religion just a way of live not believing in god due to the lack of evidence of a creator or a god type figure.
I think we've moved past the flawed formulation in the OP during the past 9 pages. Well I have anyhow
The fool hath said in his heart, There is a God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
Psalm 14, KJV revised edition
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:51 am
When did I say I don't want to hear your personal experiences? I think I've been very reasonable considering you came storming in with ridiculous accusations.
I'm sorry you've not found what you want, but I still have no idea what you think we can do.
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:51 am
(December 17, 2014 at 9:48 am)SoFarEast Wrote: I just happen to be a part of a deeply religious country, where coming out in the open is very difficult. I won't deny the misogyny of my fellow atheists here, is probably remnants of misogyny of our national culture, but I really hope when we turned that things would be different. "When [you] turned?" What, did an atheist bite you on the neck?
People are who they are. Their beliefs are a big part of that, but in your subconscious your religious beliefs share space with the other countless beliefs that shape and influence your actions and attitudes. Changing your religious belief does not automatically change the others. Becoming an atheist only fixes one of the things you are wrong about.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:51 am
(December 17, 2014 at 10:44 am)Cato Wrote: Where do you live? Knowing this would go a long in giving context to the observations you shared.
Are you studying in your home country? I'm trying to make sense of the reported difficulty of being open about your disbelief, but yet have the opportunity to attend atheist conferences as well as encountering atheists at university. I'm from India.
Identifying with atheism is hard here, or maybe that's just how I felt in my teen years considering how radical the religious elements here are. Even the mildest criticism of religion or religious or political figures is hard here. As I grew up, I grew more confident and sought out people like me.
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RE: Atheists turning to cult behaviour?
December 17, 2014 at 10:59 am
I'd be interested to see links to any of this hate speech you have encountered from atheists before, if you can find any.
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