The interesting history they don't teach in schools

[Mister Agenda]

What mechanism is in place to protect individual rights?

Well...if you listen to the libertards...they claim the "free market" will handle that.  Ignoring of course that like all of the phony gods created by mankind the free market is just as phony.  Markets exist but are subject to manipulation by rich cocksuckers.

As something of a 'libertard' myself, you seem to have us mixed up with the anarchocapitalists. Libertarians are for government, just (to varying degrees, depending on the libertarian) not so much as we have currently. One of the legitimate functions of government should be to reduce the impact on markets of the manipulations of rich cocksuckers.

[Minimalist]

Libertarians are for using the government to advance their own interests and fuck everybody else.  But they sure as hell do not want "government" preventing them from raping, pillaging and slaughtering anything that gets in the way of their greed.

That's why I can't stand the cocksuckers.

[Cato]

Libertarians are for using the government to advance their own interests and fuck everybody else.  But they sure as hell do not want "government" preventing them from raping, pillaging and slaughtering anything that gets in the way of their greed.

That's why I can't stand the cocksuckers.

Replace 'Libertarians' above with 'Democrats' or 'Republicans' and the veracity of the statement stays the same. The only difference in the second sentence is the variance between what each wants to hoard; i.e., how greed is defined.

[nihilistcat]

Well...if you listen to the libertards...they claim the "free market" will handle that.  Ignoring of course that like all of the phony gods created by mankind the free market is just as phony.  Markets exist but are subject to manipulation by rich cocksuckers.

As something of a 'libertard' myself, you seem to have us mixed up with the anarchocapitalists. Libertarians are for government, just (to varying degrees, depending on the libertarian) not so much as we have currently. One of the legitimate functions of government should be to reduce the impact on markets of the manipulations of rich cocksuckers.

And even Hayek said governments must provide a social safety net. Nonetheless, libertarianism in the US today has drifted into the never never land of Randian pseudo-logic (for the life of me, I can't understand how such a half-rate philosopher achieved so much notoriety). 

[Minimalist]

Libertarians are for using the government to advance their own interests and fuck everybody else.  But they sure as hell do not want "government" preventing them from raping, pillaging and slaughtering anything that gets in the way of their greed.

That's why I can't stand the cocksuckers.

Replace 'Libertarians' above with 'Democrats' or 'Republicans' and the veracity of the statement stays the same. The only difference in the second sentence is the variance between what each wants to hoard; i.e., how greed is defined.

The difference is that the libertarians, like the Koch brothers are not "in" government.  They stand on the side buying politicians who will fill their agenda.  In a normal society this would be called bribery and both the briber and bribee would be in jail.  Its naive to equate what is going on in the post Citizens United world with the paltry bribery which went on before.  We are now at the mercy of the oligarchs.

[nihilistcat]

Replace 'Libertarians' above with 'Democrats' or 'Republicans' and the veracity of the statement stays the same. The only difference in the second sentence is the variance between what each wants to hoard; i.e., how greed is defined.

The difference is that the libertarians, like the Koch brothers are not "in" government.  They stand on the side buying politicians who will fill their agenda.  In a normal society this would be called bribery and both the briber and bribee would be in jail.  Its naive to equate what is going on in the post Citizens United world with the paltry bribery which went on before.  We are now at the mercy of the oligarchs.

And as you indicated previously, we're at the mercy of the oligarchs, because most people (whether they admit it or not) like being passive slaves (who only hope for a benevolent master). 

[Minimalist]

I don't take a lot of comfort in that.  Frankly, I wish someone would prove Sallust wrong, but................

[Hatshepsut]

I'll even help you, here's a wiki article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restorative_justice

Or, a wiki on somewhat firmer citation basis: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restorative...ocial_work

Wikipedia is a very fast way to get basic information albeit with doubts about the reliability of what you find there. Restorative justice emphasizes fines, community service, payment of restitution, and apologies made to victims at arranged meetings. We already do that to some extent here in the USA. Yet when trying to explain why crime and incarceration rates are lower in Sweden than in the USA, one should ask what else differs between the two countries besides the structure of their respective justice systems. Sweden, for instance, has a more racially and ethnically homogeneous population than the U.S. does. It doesn't have large disparities in quality between one public school and another. There are few widespread cultures of disaffection analogous to America's Hip-Hop to teach youngsters to reject the legitimacy of their broader social order in Sweden. Because of extensive housing, health, and child care subsidies, people in low-income occupations can make ends meet with somewhat fewer hours of work needed and much less financial stress than in the USA.

In short, although I think we could get mileage simply by shortening some of our draconian sentences and de-criminalizing consumer-level drug violations without loss of crime deterrence, transforming ourselves into a Nordic country may prove quite a challenge.

What about unsavory services, like emptying your shit from a septic tank? ... Extend this to all sorts of goods and services and you quickly revert to some sort of subsistence existence.

Which is what we had during the long era when anarchism actually worked. We lived all of prehistory in bands or small tribes that were essentially self-governing without rulers. But like other posters here I have a hard time imagining you can run a complex civilization without hierarchy.

[Mister Agenda]

Libertarians are for using the government to advance their own interests and fuck everybody else.  But they sure as hell do not want "government" preventing them from raping, pillaging and slaughtering anything that gets in the way of their greed.

That's why I can't stand the cocksuckers.

Your understanding of libertarianism wouldn't fill a thimble, so I don't give your opinion on the topic any more weight than it deserves.

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Replace 'Libertarians' above with 'Democrats' or 'Republicans' and the veracity of the statement stays the same. The only difference in the second sentence is the variance between what each wants to hoard; i.e., how greed is defined.

The difference is that the libertarians, like the Koch brothers are not "in" government.  They stand on the side buying politicians who will fill their agenda.  In a normal society this would be called bribery and both the briber and bribee would be in jail.  Its naive to equate what is going on in the post Citizens United world with the paltry bribery which went on before.  We are now at the mercy of the oligarchs.

You think the Koch brothers are still libertarians? Can you name one 'libertarian' candidate they've contributed to who was actually in the LP? If they cared about libertarianism, they're plenty rich enough to throw a few million to the LP and give them enough operating funds to actually win an election or two. Is it the new thing to call Republicans, libertarians? The main difference between Republicans and libertarians is being strong on civil liberties. Have the Koch brothers impressed you with their stances on ending the War on Drugs, legalizing gay marriage, or separation of church and state?

[Minimalist]

Your understanding of libertarianism wouldn't fill a thimble, so I don't give your opinion on the topic any more weight than it deserves.

Fuck that shit, buddy.  These cocksuckers have made it perfectly clear what they expect and, unless you are a multi-billionaire, you are not in their club.