DNA Proves Existence of a Designer

[Minimalist]

[The Grand Nudger]

Yeah, this X in question is the most highly complex and specific in the known universe.

-not that it matters...since you're pretty sure all the simplest, most random, and useless information is -also- god information.

[CDF47]

The attribute inherent in and communicated by one of two or more alternative sequences or arrangements of something (such as nucleotides in DNA or binary digits in a computer program) that produce specific effects

The DNA itself doesn't produce specific effects, that is the result of the machinery surrounding it in the cell.  Like any other information, the meaning of a code is dependent upon it being embedded in a system that interprets the encoded information.  There is nothing "inherent" there whatsoever, so you're starting off on the wrong foot.   Information isn't inherent but a byproduct of system behaviors.  A strand of DNA sitting on a rock doesn't do anything at all.  In that environment, the DNA contains no information.

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DNA contains information.  Information based on human observation always comes from a mind or an intelligence.  Therefore, DNA came from a Mind or Intelligence.  This information in DNA by the way, is the most highly complex and specific information in the known universe.

And the explanation for the existence of mind or intelligence?  There are two possible explanations for mind/intelligence.  One is that it is supernatural in origin and perhaps has always existed.  The other is that it arose from natural processes.  So your inductive argument reduces to, "Information based on human observation may be supernatural in origin or it may be natural in origin."  Pardon me if I'm not impressed with your conclusion that information might not be a naturally occurring thing.

Beyond that, your argument is an induction that because we do not know of any alternative paths from nature to information, therefore no such paths are likely.  Besides being essentially an argument from ignorance, all it takes is the production of one such path to topple your argument.  Do you know that no such path will ever be found?  No, you don't.

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I don't believe there is any proof for it.  I don't believe man descended from apes either.

It really doesn't matter whether there is "proof" for it or not.  You are making an affirmative case here that depends on showing that macro-evolution could not have happened, not simply appealing to ignorance.  So far, the bulk of your argument is that it (DNA) couldn't have happened any other way but by the act of an intelligence.  In order to demonstrate your claim, you have to show that both evolution and abiogenesis are impossible.  Otherwise, all you've got is a fallacious appeal to ignorance.

It was a 0 point, a singularity.  How much energy can be contained in 0 space.  0, then all of a sudden bang.

[Joods]

Out of all of the versions of "your religion", how do you know you picked the right one? 

What evidence do you have to prove that your religion is right and all others are wrong?

It is based on the Holy Scriptures.  I use the best discernment I can to determine the text but I realize I am a fallible human.

You still didn't answer my second question. What evidence do you have to prove that your religion is right and all others are wrong? Saying you are a fallible human doesn't provide proof. It just tells me your opinion of yourself. 

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Either this guy is a sock, or he's just repeating what was already said in another thread about this.

Just pulled those figures from the web from a Pew study.

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Ahh yes. The very same study that was listed in another thread on here. Convenient.

[CDF47]

A mind that transcends this universe created it.  The proof is in the creation, in the fine-tuning of the universe and in the information in DNA to the molecular machines in the cell.

Sigh. You're assuming creation (which is what you, presumably, want to prove). The apparent fine-tuning of the universe hasn't been established to be actual fine tuning, it presumes the cosmological constants could have varied in ways that we haven't established and that there is only one cosmos, which we also can't know at this time. The 'information' in DNA being the product of a mind is what you ought to be trying to establish, instead of just repeating it over and over as if you already have.

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How could nothing create everything?

How did you establish that there ever was nothing?

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Genetic information is a digital code.

Definition of: digital code (1) A digital coding system for data in a computer. See ASCII and EBCDIC. (2) A coding system used to abbreviate data; for example, codes for regions, classes, products and status.

dig·i·tal
/ˈdijidl/
adjective
adjective: digital

1. (of signals or data) expressed as series of the digits 0 and 1, typically represented by values of a physical quantity such as voltage or magnetic polarization.

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Where are your stats coming from.  Post a link or quote a source.

Who are you to demand that I act as your research monkey?

Atheist claim there was nothing which created everything.  It's all random or it's designed.  Simple as that.

DNA contains 4 digit digital code.  Digital code is not always binary 0s and 1s.  I would post a link but I was told not to post too many links for first 30 days.

[The Grand Nudger]

Atheist claim there was nothing which created everything.  It's all random or it's designed.  Simple as that.

Both of those statements are simple......and they're also simply false.

Would you like to know more?

[LadyForCamus]

Sigh. You're assuming creation (which is what you, presumably, want to prove). The apparent fine-tuning of the universe hasn't been established to be actual fine tuning, it presumes the cosmological constants could have varied in ways that we haven't established and that there is only one cosmos, which we also can't know at this time. The 'information' in DNA being the product of a mind is what you ought to be trying to establish, instead of just repeating it over and over as if you already have.

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How did you establish that there ever was nothing?

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Definition of: digital code (1) A digital coding system for data in a computer. See ASCII and EBCDIC. (2) A coding system used to abbreviate data; for example, codes for regions, classes, products and status.

dig·i·tal
/ˈdijidl/
adjective
adjective: digital

1. (of signals or data) expressed as series of the digits 0 and 1, typically represented by values of a physical quantity such as voltage or magnetic polarization.

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Who are you to demand that I act as your research monkey?

Atheist claim there was nothing which created everything.  It's all random or it's designed.  Simple as that.

DNA contains 4 digit digital code.  Digital code is not always binary 0s and 1s.  I would post a link but I was told not to post too many links for first 30 days.

No, “atheists” make no such claim.  Atheists don’t believe in your god because there is no evidence of its existence.

[CDF47]

It is based on the Holy Scriptures.  I use the best discernment I can to determine the text but I realize I am a fallible human.

You still didn't answer my second question. What evidence do you have to prove that your religion is right and all others are wrong? Saying you are a fallible human doesn't provide proof. It just tells me your opinion of yourself. 

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Either this guy is a sock, or he's just repeating what was already said in another thread about this.

Just pulled those figures from the web from a Pew study.

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Ahh yes. The very same study that was listed in another thread on here. Convenient.

Based on the creation story versus other religions.  Being the only religion that says we cannot save ourselves, the Son of God had to do it.  Based on the historical and Biblical Jesus.  Based on my faith in the Lord Jesus.  I follow and believe in the Holy Scriptures.

[Joods]

Atheist claim there was nothing which created everything.  It's all random or it's designed.  Simple as that.

DNA contains 4 digit digital code.  Digital code is not always binary 0s and 1s.  I would post a link but I was told not to post too many links for first 30 days.

No, “atheists” make no such claim.  Atheists don’t believe in your god because there is no evidence of its existence.

But but but.....

The bible said so! Therefore it MUST be true! 



This meme never gets old and I've used it plenty of times on here to make a point.

[Angrboda]

The DNA itself doesn't produce specific effects, that is the result of the machinery surrounding it in the cell.  Like any other information, the meaning of a code is dependent upon it being embedded in a system that interprets the encoded information.  There is nothing "inherent" there whatsoever, so you're starting off on the wrong foot.   Information isn't inherent but a byproduct of system behaviors.  A strand of DNA sitting on a rock doesn't do anything at all.  In that environment, the DNA contains no information.

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And the explanation for the existence of mind or intelligence?  There are two possible explanations for mind/intelligence.  One is that it is supernatural in origin and perhaps has always existed.  The other is that it arose from natural processes.  So your inductive argument reduces to, "Information based on human observation may be supernatural in origin or it may be natural in origin."  Pardon me if I'm not impressed with your conclusion that information might not be a naturally occurring thing.

Beyond that, your argument is an induction that because we do not know of any alternative paths from nature to information, therefore no such paths are likely.  Besides being essentially an argument from ignorance, all it takes is the production of one such path to topple your argument.  Do you know that no such path will ever be found?  No, you don't.

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It really doesn't matter whether there is "proof" for it or not.  You are making an affirmative case here that depends on showing that macro-evolution could not have happened, not simply appealing to ignorance.  So far, the bulk of your argument is that it (DNA) couldn't have happened any other way but by the act of an intelligence.  In order to demonstrate your claim, you have to show that both evolution and abiogenesis are impossible.  Otherwise, all you've got is a fallacious appeal to ignorance.

It was a 0 point, a singularity.  How much energy can be contained in 0 space.  0, then all of a sudden bang.

No offense, but your reply has fuckall to do with the things I wrote.