A few points of conflict with Jackie L's (Eilonnwy) article.

[thesummerqueen]

My point wasn't snideness it was an attempt to make tav think for himself rather than be presented with what he would see as an argument to counter. Fact is it's already been said and ignored before.

I realize people are already asking you to state your point for other reasons, but I wanted to add here that I'd like you to do so because of this:

At some point over the last year, I heard Phil Plait repeat the idea that even if you cannot convince the person you are arguing with, you have no idea how many people you might "convert" who are listening around you. Of course, he was talking about skeptics trying to bring reason to believers.

Maybe Tav would have disagreed and argued more, maybe he wouldn't (I don't know him yet, though I'd certainly like to), but there's a chance your statement could have provided clarity to the rest of us that hadn't been provided in other posts. This kinda goes along with what I was saying earlier - no one thinks the same way. If you restated the position, who knows which of us might stop and say "...oh!"