(December 29, 2010 at 3:25 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:I have found an argument for Islam that in this case I will copy to let you read it. Mohammed (blessed be his name) succeeded to let preserve the true words of god unfalsified until today.Quote:Allah choose Mohammed(blessed be his name) because of his pure heart and worthyness without equal.
Blah blah blah. Every religion claims such things about their prophets. This one's a wash, if it can be called an "argument" at all.
Quote:Islam is the only unadulterated version of Allah’s word. The Qur’an is also known as the Criterion (al-Furqan), in that it distinguishes between revealed Truth and man-made accretions in all earlier scriptures. Even the bitterest foes of Islam are willing to admit that the Qur’an is in the exact same form as it was since the time of Muhammad (peace be upon him), while few objective sources would hold the same to be true of the Old and New testaments. The message of tawheed (oneness of God) is the same since the beginning of time.
We can still see glimmers of it in the messages of Christianity and Judaism. However, the Judeo-Christian tradition has added to the concept of tawheed, be it in the form of the Trinitarian doctrine or the “chosen people” mentality. Additionally, the Sacred Law changes with each subsequent Prophet of Allah.
Thus, the law of Jesus and the law of Moses (peace be upon them) was abrogated with the advent of Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him). It is obligatory upon us to follow the most current Sacred Law in order to reach Allah. The obsolete nature of Jewish and Christian law is why you will find very few Christians concerned with the laws that Jesus taught and followed, and you will find very few Jews that follow the 613 mitzvah fully while simultaneously integrating themselves effectively into gentile society.
Islam is the Truth and the answer to all questions, both metaphysical and profane. Allah has given us everything, and He wants from us our belief, love, and sacrifice for His sake. This is obvious in a Qur’anic verse that means:
*{Surely my prayer and my sacrifice and my life and my death are (all) for Allah, the Lord of the worlds.}
http://www.43things.com/things/view/2075...t-to-islam
(December 29, 2010 at 3:25 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:I do not agree with your words.(An example against them would be countries like the christian mexiko, filled with slums and ruled by drug lords). But for the moment I wont debate them, but give you this truth:Quote:The christians needed several centuries to win the whole roman empire for their false religion, but the muslims managed to take a gigantic part of it from them within one generation after Mohammed(blessed be his name) and hold all of it until today (except granada and armenia).
No prophet before or after mohammed ever was that succesfull.
Wouldnt you say that this speaks very much for him?
Again, if we're going by success = a sign of which religion is most legitimate, I think Christianity is the one with a leg up on their competition, both in terms of numbers and in terms of which culture has been more successful for the last several hundred years.
Satan can always pretend to be succesfull, for he is the Lord of lies. But there is worldly succes, and there is spiritual success. The only success that brings you the grace of Allah is your spritual success that you get only by embracing Islam.
(December 29, 2010 at 3:25 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:Yes. But just like all elephants are elephants, all prophets are great prophets because of theyr holyness, their appointedness. This appointedness comes with birth - they are born with it and that means they are born with greatness. As all elephants are born as elephants.Quote:there is no such thing as a failed prophed because all prophets are great.
The word "great" can only have meaning if its used as opposed to "not great".
And, if you will so, all the great prophets are opposed to normal people who are not neccessarily great.
(December 29, 2010 at 3:25 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:Jesus convinced the people rightfully that Allah wants not only Jews but all people to serve him.Quote:Or else you would have to call the two prophets that were murdered by the jews in the OT also failed prophets.
Not if they convinced people of the true way.
That was a enormous success.
It is another story that later humans perverted parts of his message to things like the christian Trinity dogma.
(December 29, 2010 at 3:25 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:No . See above. Jesus invited all humans to serve Allah and was a worthy precessor of Mohammed (blessed be his name).Quote:That "another country argument" of you is still ridiculous. Do you think that Allah saw rome as the heart of the world? Rome was just the home of the false apostle called Pope.
So Allah wrote off Christianity as a lost cause. Fine. Still speaks volumes about how Jesus was an ultimate failure as a prophet.
(December 29, 2010 at 3:25 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:Have you even tried to read the Quran. Did you try to understand it? You have to read a commented Quran, because many sentences therein are not understandable without comments about the historical contexts and such.Quote:And still another reason is the unequaled beautiness of the arabian language. Allah wanted to tell his last prophet the Koran in the most beautiful language there is. Arabic, which is spoken in Arabia
So the arguments for Islam so far include:
1. Success (same could be said for Christianity)
2. Oooooh, pretty poetry.
About success I wrote above, and this particular pretty poertry is also the truest word of god. But you wont see that without reading it with an open heart.
(December 29, 2010 at 3:25 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:Islam had no holy Inquisition and was historically more tolerant to unbelievers than christianity.Quote:I did not say greatest success story = authentic religion, but what would have become of pauls teachings without constantine later making christianity state religion?
Both religions were spread by conquest and persecution. That argument's a wash.
(December 29, 2010 at 3:25 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:i would not put it that way.Quote:I think Allahs plan is very clear to see here. Divine logic that led to success.
And we come back to success = the right one.
This argument might be less ridiculous if most of the Islamic world wasn't currently festering in its own Dark Ages.
And are not christian countries festering instead in Drugs, Slums, Kid Porn, all kinds of immorality, corrupt rulers who often like to go to war with other countries, etcetera.
And are not many christian countries suffering a rapid decline of religious people ?
That is not the case in islamic countries, so the spiritual success belongs to Islam