Shia & Sunna: Why I don't believe

[WinterHold]

Brian37

Atlas, as well intended as you are, and it is great that Muslims are questioning other Muslims like this, you gave the answer as to why it is "tribal madness" away in your own answer. 

That is the reason, right there, but not just why Muslims are divided, no, this is what religion does, causes divisions, and all religions have them. It's not that religion was raped, it was a bad idea in the first place. Now again, that is not saying you can end it by force, you cant.

Self criticism never harms. Humility and looking back at our trails, observing the points of error in our methods, techniques and ideology is the way to go indeed.
We might be divided in thought, but nothing gives us the excuse to enforce our thoughts on others, the problem begins with the concept of one seeing themselves as guardians and responsible upon others, and it never ends there of course, it actually ends with death.

I was referring the region being raped, but the religion in my opinion didn't lose a thing; theists raped me, us, the land, the societies, persephonie is us, Hades is the scholars. They tricked us into tasting food from the underworld, and now we have to contribute our life and souls to them; spend some time in the dark with them; by force of course.

Ah, I'm not mad. Simply: sure, each of us would believe in something, we will always be different, but for others to use tricks and cheap missionary work -that is decorated by violence in many cases- to bring us into a false ideology, that is so built on playing gymnastics around syntax, raping us into submission with threats and force, for ...1400 years now? It's not like I know the creatures of the underworld; especially when their history is one nasty piece of history.

But you should consider the times ALL religions, including prior polytheism got started in. Hinduism, Buddhism, the Ancient Greeks and Romans and the Egyptians all lived in class systems ruled by Royalty and the second class was the warrior class, then the serfs no name. And back then the mortality rate was much higher, and back then your survival as a subject of that king depended on the tribe doing what that ruler said. 

Even the ancient Romans were not modern democracies, they were also ruled by immovable Cesars whom if they wanted them removed before they died, often came from political murder or family murder, not court impeachment. 

The thing I respect the west mostly for, is the elimination of tribalism. I believe that nationalism did replace tribalism in the west, and now something else began to replace nationalism, I didn't decide yet what I should call it. But the west contributed a lot to multiculturalism, a lot of part still backward in this regard, but compare them to the middle east..

Most of the M.E countries didn't get over tribalism yet. Countries are called after "families" in here (Saudi Arabia for example). No doubt, the west is light years ahead in that regard.

Personally, here where I think Islam makes a difference. It fights the concepts polythism, and take us into the highest level of social liberty, that is above tribalism, nationalism & the current vague level that I cannot find a name for..it advocates multiculturism beyond believe, and that is something making me attracted to it.

"Tribal madness" has only been tamped down in the secular west, but the underpinnings are still there. We have Christians on the right who don't agree with Christians on the left. We have our right justifying harm to gays, control over female bodies, and constant claims of "Christian nation". 

All holy books of Christians and Jews and Muslims are weapons and all of them are used to justify both compassion and cruelty. The only difference between the east and the west is that we have had a longer time managing our differences to a more civil degree. But believe me, I don't value the mentality of universal blanket force to any bad those in the East do and justify it with the Quran. And I run into even some atheists who value blanket solutions of force as a default. I am not one of them.

Anything can be used as a weapon. Humans turned beautiful things like music into weapons of war; the drums of war are nothing but an example..
The universal blanket thing is a Valium, it helps people sleep at night.

I think it is worth it for my species to consider worldwide, that it isn't enough to simply point to the pretty stories and acts of kindness, they all have them. I think the bigger picture is to consider that our ability to be cruel or compassionate is not in the holy writing itself, but our evolution that we project into those writings and mistake it as the source. 

But I am certainly willing to concede an imperfect word and as long as you at least insist your own label, and I mean all religions, reduce any and all as much as possible, on all sides, the excuse to pick up a book and justify violence with it, it certainly is far better than a "scorched earth" policy. I don't remember who said it, but "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind".

It's something about human ego that hates to admit one's own cruelty. Or do we enjoy it sometimes, deep inside, on a certain level? I actually don't know for sure.