RE: Why is Allah holding Iblis to a different standard than the other Jinn?
June 5, 2016 at 10:22 am
(This post was last modified: June 5, 2016 at 10:23 am by WinterHold.)
[quote pid='1293470' dateline='1465122643']
MrNoMorePropaganda
If the the case that people are guided by Allah, why are you on Atheist Forums? If Allah guides people then you have no business doing Dawah because Allah would guide these people without you telling them about Allah. It's like those people who protest draw Muhammad events. They know, really, that Allah won't do a Quran 13:13 on the people drawing Muhammad so they have to do the work of Allah for Allah.
And why did Satan have pride and arrogance? The answer is because Allah did not create him humble. Allah didn't have to create Satan.
And to answer your question of why I have not recited Shahada. Everything I've said so far makes Allah sound pretty evil and don't get me started on Noah's Flood. The Quran mentions "waves the size of mountains" in 11:42. There is not enough water to flood the Earth.
And, another things, Allah is admitted that it made a mistake by doing the flood. I'll say it again: Allah did not have to create Satan. The flood happened because Allah gave Satan power. So all of those people that Allah had die needlessly in the flood died because Allah thought creating Satan was a good idea.
Allah did a pretty bad job at guiding at Noah's contemporaries. But there wouldn't have been enough room on the ark for every single person even if Allah had guided them. How do you fit millions of people on a boat?
Honestly, this all sounds like Allah is playing some kind of sick video game. We are the game characters and it's like the Sims game. Allah has a lot of fun making us suffer.
Not only that, our universe has no need for a creator. People try to define Allah into existence when there really is no need to. Our universe is not perfectly designed and is in fact a very dangerous place. Have you seen what it can do?
The idea of multiple universes is gaining traction. The more we learn as a species the more insignificant we become. First it was the Earth is the middle of the universe, then we found out that was silly. Then it was our galaxy is the only one and now we know there are more galaxies than people on the entire Earth, more stars than grains of the sand on the Earth, and probably even more universes than that. Each galaxy has billions to trillions of stars, and most stars, we now know, have multiple plants orbiting them.
Really does seem terribly wasteful of Allah. If the Earth was the only planet then you might have a point of our universe being perfectly designed. But we already know there are more stars in our universe than grains of sand on the Earth. With so many star systems, the fact is often stranger than the fiction. There are planets that have exceeded even our wildest expectations.
So if Allah knows the suffering of all of people the hellfire, some of which will be good people, then why doesn't Allah get rid of the hellfire? It seems to me Allah enjoys doing battle with Satan because Allah doesn't mind seeing people in the hellfire. Allah created Satan knowing that Satan would refuse to bow to Adam. And, I'll say it again, Satan is objectively better than Adam.
The point is they came first. When the Israelites went to Babylon they copied stories like the Epic of Gilgamesh and adapted them to their culture to create the story of Noah for example. Zoroaster came before even Judaism, and we see the influence his religion has had on religions that came after his.
To focus on that is to miss the point. Later thirties, early forties. A few years don't matter too much. The point is, Zoroaster was born into a wealth family, but he gave that up in order to upset the system. Like Muhammad, he was offered lots of nice things, if only he would stop preaching strict monotheism. But the angel kept coming to Zoroaster, and he kept on preaching strict monotheism even though it put his life in danger.
Another similarity we see is that in Zoroaster's religion, god had 101 names. That's only two more than Allah. And quite a number of the names are similar to those of Allah.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/101_Names_of_God
So to recap:
1. Zoroastrians have very similar creation story; the Evil Spirit, like Ibilis, refuse to praise man and this is why there is suffering.
2. The have 101 names for god, Allah has 99
3. Zoroaster preached a strict monotheism which upset those in power, like Muhammad.
4. Zoroaster received his revelations gradually from an angel of god, like Muhammad
5. Zoroastrians wash before pray, and this like Wudu
6. Zoroastrians are required to pray five times each day.
7. Zoroastrians are encouraged to wear white when they go to the temple to pray, like how the people are encourage to wear white for the Friday Prayer in the Mosque.
Come on, that's more than just a coincidence. The Arabs copied Zoroaster, just like the ancient people of Israel did. The Quran is not unique.
[/quote]
I'm thinking about this; I have quite a different opinion, I don't think angles are made out of light though, that's a Hadith after all.
Going to post later, totally out of mood, mental strength; so
..
But wanted to thank you for this comment; it's a goldmine !
I discussed Zoroastrian traditions with you once, but I need to go read more about them.
Thank you for sharing this; MNMP
MrNoMorePropaganda
Quote:Answer:Allah gave Satan free-will to disobey. When he disobeyed Allah, Allah evicted him from Paradise. This made Satan extremely upset so he promised to lead the sons of Adam astray, thinking he was threatening Allah in a way. So Allah tells him "You and anyone who follows your lead I will certainly fill Hell with. But I assure you, you will only lead astray those whom I chose not to guide, for those whom I guide none can lead them astray" 'So what you're saying is we are paying the price because Allah created Satan when there clearly was no need to. Allah, the all-knowing (Al-ʿAlim, one of the ninety-nine names of Allah), knew Satan would lead the sons of Adam astray. Yes, the Quran has several verses saying something to the effect of "Allah guides whom he wills".
If the the case that people are guided by Allah, why are you on Atheist Forums? If Allah guides people then you have no business doing Dawah because Allah would guide these people without you telling them about Allah. It's like those people who protest draw Muhammad events. They know, really, that Allah won't do a Quran 13:13 on the people drawing Muhammad so they have to do the work of Allah for Allah.
Quote:The reason Satan (Iblis) didn't bow to Adam pbuh was because of his pride and arrogance.
And why did Satan have pride and arrogance? The answer is because Allah did not create him humble. Allah didn't have to create Satan.
Quote:All-Knowing Lord Allah says, I know I'm better than AdamBut Satan is better than Adam. Adam is not supernatural. Satan is objectively more powerful than Adam. If I could chose between clay and fire I'd chose fire without hesitation. Clay just sits there doing nothing. Fire is animated; it can grow - it's hot and it has a much bigger impact on the world than clay.
And to answer your question of why I have not recited Shahada. Everything I've said so far makes Allah sound pretty evil and don't get me started on Noah's Flood. The Quran mentions "waves the size of mountains" in 11:42. There is not enough water to flood the Earth.
And, another things, Allah is admitted that it made a mistake by doing the flood. I'll say it again: Allah did not have to create Satan. The flood happened because Allah gave Satan power. So all of those people that Allah had die needlessly in the flood died because Allah thought creating Satan was a good idea.
Allah did a pretty bad job at guiding at Noah's contemporaries. But there wouldn't have been enough room on the ark for every single person even if Allah had guided them. How do you fit millions of people on a boat?
Honestly, this all sounds like Allah is playing some kind of sick video game. We are the game characters and it's like the Sims game. Allah has a lot of fun making us suffer.
Not only that, our universe has no need for a creator. People try to define Allah into existence when there really is no need to. Our universe is not perfectly designed and is in fact a very dangerous place. Have you seen what it can do?
The idea of multiple universes is gaining traction. The more we learn as a species the more insignificant we become. First it was the Earth is the middle of the universe, then we found out that was silly. Then it was our galaxy is the only one and now we know there are more galaxies than people on the entire Earth, more stars than grains of the sand on the Earth, and probably even more universes than that. Each galaxy has billions to trillions of stars, and most stars, we now know, have multiple plants orbiting them.
Really does seem terribly wasteful of Allah. If the Earth was the only planet then you might have a point of our universe being perfectly designed. But we already know there are more stars in our universe than grains of sand on the Earth. With so many star systems, the fact is often stranger than the fiction. There are planets that have exceeded even our wildest expectations.
Quote:Allah is All-Seeing, All-Knowing and has dominion over ALL things this includes Hellfire.
So if Allah knows the suffering of all of people the hellfire, some of which will be good people, then why doesn't Allah get rid of the hellfire? It seems to me Allah enjoys doing battle with Satan because Allah doesn't mind seeing people in the hellfire. Allah created Satan knowing that Satan would refuse to bow to Adam. And, I'll say it again, Satan is objectively better than Adam.
Quote:These were Persians who were near Arabia and the Middle East. So many of their cultures and lifestyles (aside from religion and worship), had similarities with Islam.
The point is they came first. When the Israelites went to Babylon they copied stories like the Epic of Gilgamesh and adapted them to their culture to create the story of Noah for example. Zoroaster came before even Judaism, and we see the influence his religion has had on religions that came after his.
Quote:Well Prophet Muhammad pbuh was 40 years old when he first received the revelation from Angel Gabriel
To focus on that is to miss the point. Later thirties, early forties. A few years don't matter too much. The point is, Zoroaster was born into a wealth family, but he gave that up in order to upset the system. Like Muhammad, he was offered lots of nice things, if only he would stop preaching strict monotheism. But the angel kept coming to Zoroaster, and he kept on preaching strict monotheism even though it put his life in danger.
Another similarity we see is that in Zoroaster's religion, god had 101 names. That's only two more than Allah. And quite a number of the names are similar to those of Allah.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/101_Names_of_God
So to recap:
1. Zoroastrians have very similar creation story; the Evil Spirit, like Ibilis, refuse to praise man and this is why there is suffering.
2. The have 101 names for god, Allah has 99
3. Zoroaster preached a strict monotheism which upset those in power, like Muhammad.
4. Zoroaster received his revelations gradually from an angel of god, like Muhammad
5. Zoroastrians wash before pray, and this like Wudu
6. Zoroastrians are required to pray five times each day.
7. Zoroastrians are encouraged to wear white when they go to the temple to pray, like how the people are encourage to wear white for the Friday Prayer in the Mosque.
Come on, that's more than just a coincidence. The Arabs copied Zoroaster, just like the ancient people of Israel did. The Quran is not unique.
[/quote]
I'm thinking about this; I have quite a different opinion, I don't think angles are made out of light though, that's a Hadith after all.
Going to post later, totally out of mood, mental strength; so
..But wanted to thank you for this comment; it's a goldmine !
I discussed Zoroastrian traditions with you once, but I need to go read more about them.
Thank you for sharing this; MNMP
