(November 17, 2016 at 8:10 am)Alasdair Ham Wrote: It's no surprise or coincidence that the largest version of the most popular religion in the world's conceptualization of God is both the vaguest and most unfalsifiable. The Catholic's conceptualization of God is so successful because it's so irrefutable. But why is it so irrefutable? Because there's nothing fucking there to refute, it's as vague as shit, lol. It's like.... religion is so popular because most people are morons who don't recognize that falsifiability is a strength.
I think that this is the end game for all religion, eventually. There is one point you can get almost every theist to agree on, and that is that god's existence is evident. If we put aside the quality of the evidence used to reach that conclusion and grant it, we have one claim that they can agree on: a god exists, because at least one has to exist.
But you are still very far from determining who or what that/those god(s) is/are. And this is where we run into the problem of a god or gods that exist outside of the range of our perception so that the only evidence we think we have is his/their smudgy fingerprints scattered all over the place. Fingerprints that are so smudgy that not only can we not make a definitive identification, we cannot even be certain that they're fingerprints at all. There are lots of other people claiming that they are the fingerprints of a different god/gods altogether, and their methods are strikingly similar to yours, yet they do not come to the same conclusion, which casts doubt on their effectiveness. And to complicate matters even further, science continues to demonstrate that those smudges aren't fingerprints at all. They're just smudges.
If religion only did good, or only moved humanity forward, or only taught ideas that bring people together, then none of this would be an issue. But they have not developed that way, and only the inexorable advance of human reason has had any sort of positive effect on us as a whole. God will eventually be nothing more than some sort of "spirit of cooperation" or "goodness" that impels mankind forward. But there's a long and painful road to traverse before we get there.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
-Stephen Jay Gould