Now and before.

[Godscreated]

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I took out portions of your post to make this simpler, not to change what you had to say.

I take it that you are in support of the "big bang" as scientific fact. Yet there are secular scientist who have considerable doubt about this assumed fact.
Lately many things have brought the "big bang" into question and one is red shift. We also know that there is a need for dark matter to keep the "big bang assumption" alive and well with all the new data we have. I'm guessing you are also in support of dark matter. You and most all "big bang" supporters are because it holds the theory together. Yet in the last 40 years in neutral labs as you call them not one bit of dark matter has ever been detected, not a micron of evidence exist for it, period. Yet people make scientific shows and put them on TV, it's written about in magazines and scientific articles like it is the most proven thing in the history of man, and that is a bald faced lie.
Science claims it is invisible an can't be seen, once heard that before from you and them about God, where is He we can't see Him give us proof. Yet you'll accept this magic material, yes magic because it's the only thing holding the "big bang" theory together, no proof not a micron. You toss away Jesus like trash because you think He is a figment of the imagination of the Christian Church, yet we do have writings about Him and from many sources, yet you will support with your last breath an invisible magic matter while calling Christians delusional. What are you going to say after the next 40 years and the "magical matter" still hasn't a micron of actual proof from those neutral labs, which means there still will be no real and honest peer reviews?
Call me crazy and or delusional because l believe in a God who has been argued over and attested to by the likes of Newton if that's what makes you happy. Just remember that you fit your own criticism of my belief in God with your support of dark matter and it's magical properties to hold up the "big bang assumption."

GC

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The cases are not parallel: There is evidence for dark matter, there is no evidence for God. Nothing in physics makes sense without the dark matter hypothesis, nothing - full stop - is helped by the God hypothesis.

Further more, 'proof' isn't measured in microns - a micron is one one-millionth of a meter, so I'm not sure what you mean by this. Also, what is a 'neutral lab'?

Boru

"The cases are not parallel," this is just a reflective statement. There is no evidence for dark matter, how can you have evidence of something unseen and no lab evidence, not a micron. By the way if for no other reason, l'm a woodworker and l hand sharpen my hand cutting tools and the media used is measured in microns. The "big bang" seemed to be a!right until we found the universe was on a supposed never ending expansion. Then something had to be invented to plug in to make sense of an expanding universe, that something was invisible matter, invisible, why, for the reason it couldn't be anything else, science needed something invisible to explain why we could use the red shift, which we know it too has started to be questioned. Ask Brian37 what a neutral lab is, l personally would have used "independent lab," but I knew what he meant. You can argue for dark matter forever, but until it is proven and verified by peer review l'm not buying it, sorry Boru but this is how you try to hold Christians feet to the fire and ...Well your feet are going to be placed in the same place.

GC