What is logic?

[Angrboda]

It's a simple fact, either NDEs are all real, or they're all hallucinatory.  You don't get to say that some are real, while some are not.  They are all the same type of event.  They're either ALL real, or they're ALL false.  You don't get to pick and choose and say that while a few are clearly hallucinatory, these others over here are clearly real.  Since there are documented NDEs that are clearly hallucinatory, the only logical conclusion is that they are all hallucinatory.  What you touted as evidence is actually nothing of the sort.  Just a bunch of hallucinatory experiences.

And with that, your so called "evidence" vanishes in a poof of smoke.  And since you have no other credible evidence, your entire worldview rests on nothing but dogma.




You've just been given evidence to the contrary.  So much for your "claim."

That is a load o'crap yog.

It is a fact that we are all different therefore God can not possibly show Him-Herself (no sex) in the same way to
everybody.
We carry different karma so the help that God give to one can not be the same to somebody else.
There are different stages of samadhi or bliss.
Why should we all experience the same level of bliss when someone deserve more or less than other people?

That is nothing but fairy tales.  It's an ad hoc rationalization for why there are hallucinatory features in people's NDEs.  God or not God is what is at issue here.  You can't use what you hope to prove with these hallucinatory experiences to explain the hallucinatory experience.  That's simply begging the question.  Your answer doesn't come close to explaining why there are imaginary things inside people's NDE experiences.  The simplest answer is that the entire NDE is imaginary.  That's parsimony.  Not this made up ad hoc shit that you pulled from your ass. a) You have no way of knowing this, and b) it puts the veracity of the whole experience in doubt.  If a woman can imagine herself wearing long johns, why can't she imagine all the rest?  Your answer is a kind of "trust me, the two things are different."  Well no, they aren't.  If the long johns are made up, so is the rest of it.

Your problem yog is that you go around with blinkers on your eyes.

No, I don't.  Your problem is you make up bullshit stories that don't half answer the question.

One more problem yog.
Hallucinations happen when the brain is alive or not yet dead while NDEs come when the brain is dead.
Most of your examples do not state whether the guy was alive or dead at the time when the vision or the NDE happen so
it is impossible to know whether the people hallucinated or they had an NDE.

I knew that you would try this line of bullshit.  While I'm happy to see you so readily abandon your former claims about how NDEs can't be hallucinations because they're so vivid and real, the fact is that this is irrelevant back-pedaling in the face of a failure of your argument.  Whether the brain is dead or not, and whether hallucinations can occur under such circumstances, is only settled by the experiences themselves.  Here you're trying to make an arbitrary distinction between "real NDEs" and hallucinations based on your guesses about what happens when a patient flatlines.  That's just speculation.  What we do know is that people have real, vivid, hallucinatory experiences complete with OBEs and lights at the end of the tunnel, and ALL THE DETAILS are imaginary.  Trying to separate them out into dead and not dead is just another failed attempt on your part to introduce meaningless distinctions.  The experiences are the same, therefore the process is the same. We don't have NDEs that are real AND an additional category of NDEs that are imaginary. There's just one category, and it's hallucinations.

One more failing Yog.
NDEs do net necessary come with total bliss.
Take the case of Storm.
In the beginning Storm experienced a terrible feeling like hell to then go through a stage of pure bliss.
Why is that so?
God give these experiences to teach a lesson as well.
In this case Storm had to learn that by living like an idiot he was doing wrong so by see how bad he would feel in the real reality once his body die he learn not to do those bad things again.
Only after that God let him experience the bliss so many of your examples in which people experience
difficult situations may well be lessons that these people have to learn.

This is just more irrelevant crap which doesn't explain why people have hallucinatory features in their NDEs.  It's just a load of stalling crap and is based on nothing but dogma.  Look, it's real simple.  I'll show you:

1. EITHER all NDEs are real OR all NDEs are false;                 (law of parsimony)
2. IF some NDEs are hallucinations, THEN all NDEs are hallucinations;  (by 1)
3. Some NDEs are hallucinations;                                       (previous post)
4. Therefore all NDEs are hallucinations                               (by 2 and 3)

You wanted logic?  You got logic.  Now answer the argument or don't.  No more of these fairy tale whinings about "well God would do this" or "God would do that" -- you are not God, and your guesses about what God would do are irrelevant and are the worst kind of ad hoc bullshit.  Answer the argument or don't.

In other words.........................FAIL ONCE AGAIN YOG.  

The only failure here is your failure to come to terms with reality.

---

So...

1. Materialistic endeavors cannot lead to permanent happiness
2. Therefore happiness must come from within.
3. Therefore god.

This is logic?

Not only do you not offer any new arguments... you're not even really offering any argument at all.

This thread is pointless.

Actually is the atheistic logic that is pointless.    

My logic works like this Ace..........by realizing that the material world doesn't offer any real progress the intelligent and smart person would automatically look within while the fool would keep on going around and around hoping that sooner or later the things turn around his way.
That is a gambler attitude not the smart and intelligent attitude.
Forget whether you may or may not find God by looking within.
The important thing is to try something else once you realize that the old way doesn't work.
This is LOGIC Ace.  

Sure, don't just stand there. DO SOMETHING! The problem with this is that some things are helpful. Some things are not. And some problems have no solution, so "just do anything" is a waste of time. The wise person is the one who realizes that the quest for permanent peace of mind is a pipe dream, and that the only real solution is to struggle for what meaning is available in this life, not sitting around meditating on a mantra given to you by a long dead con man. Your NDE evidence is crap. And your Yoga is a lie. It can't deliver permanent happiness because nothing can. And saying "do something, anything" is a pointless distraction to the real problems people face. Go ahead and waste your life in pointless yoga. Quit telling other people it's the way to permanent peace of mind. You don't have it, and you've never known anyone else to have it either. All you are doing is making up lies about something you don't know shit about.