I Used To Be A Fan But I Am Now Shocked, Disgusted And Appalled With Sam Harris

[SteelCurtain]

Everyone has a big turd fly out of their mouth periodically, its just a matter of what kind and how they recover it (if ever).

I'll let many things pass if one walks back later and disowns it fully. I know what it's like to be an angry ape in a rather tone deaf universe. I also note when others embrace shit easily.

That's why forgiving Nazis is a no-go, but ex-Nazis, maybe. It's a matter of context and face.

I remember lionizing PZ Myers and the other New Atheists. He became increasingly toxic and mean - a bully. Bullies don't stand up for others, they only think of themselves. So I walked away from my youthful adulation to find my own path.

I disagree with SteelCurtain on this topic. No one is entitled to your trust or belief. Not even the Great Sam Harris. Nor is it a personal identifiable failure to discover you don't like it when a metaphorical turd flies out of their mouths. I have not observed you advocate for penalizing Sam Harris - deciding you really don't like someone is not a punishment.

Just remember that there are varying degrees of faith, bigotry that have varying degrees of time and stickiness. Which means sometimes it's salvageable, sometimes not and sometimes it doesn't matter. Life has many opportunities for improvement.

I think we actually agree on most everything. I don't think Hammy has a responsibility to keep being a fan of Sam Harris or anything. My comment is that this whole thing is, to me, an overreaction to what actually happened. I don't think Harris was endorsing Murray's comments, I think he was using the whole situation to highlight letting other opinions out there. Him shutting Murray down would be exactly the response he (Harris) is against. People make jokes about Caitlyn Jenner all the time. Some of them are funny, some of them aren't, some are borderline. Some of them come from the gay community, who have traditionally been tribal within the subsects of the queer community at large.

My only bug is the ease with which people are willing to write someone off completely if they don't fall in line like they want. I vehemently oppose Murray's comments, but they seem more like a sassy gay dude being an asshole to his own tribe (the LGBTQ community) and making jokes than they do someone being intentionally harmful or bigoted towards the trans community. Even if Harris agrees with Murray, which I haven't seen any evidence of, personally I disagree with the overblown response here.

I liken it to a personal thing for me, Bill Maher. Bill Maher had Milo Yiannopoulos on. The guy said some terrible shit about trans people, and said it in a pithy, sassy way, and Bill Maher laughed. Bill Maher also is borderline anti-vaxx and has an obsession with Monsanto that is borderline harmful. He just did a big thing about the harm in trying to go to Mars that I vehemently disagree with. But I am still a fan because 90% of the shit he says, I believe is either helpful, funny, or both. I am not saying it is wrong for Hammy to not be a fan of Sam Harris anymore. You do you. I am saying it, to me, is indicative of the ideological purity problem that plagues liberals and progressives. I really do think that this issue is going to be the thing that allows more Donald Trumps to happen, and I believe it to be extremely harmful.