High school shooting in Parkland FL

[RoadRunner79]

Similarly for many places which have enacted gun bans, while they did eventually minimize gun deaths, they didn't have that much effect on overall deaths.  People within a time, realized that they could kill themselves or kill others with things besides a gun.  There may be some instances where the lack of a gun will change things, but for someone who wants to kill another, the problem isn't the weapon. 

I made a case a couple of pages back about how the availability of guns seemingly leads to an increase in the number of actual deaths (caused by guns).
Indeed, I didn't present stats on the overall homicide rate, regardless of the means to achieve it... but I think that it would only add one more nail in the argument that gun availability does cause more deaths.

I think I did see that, but often it's the same comments, so I may not have said anything.  Just from what you had said here, the actual number of gun deaths.This figure likely includes suicides, which account for about 2/3 of gun deaths.  The picture looks a little different when you look at gun related homicides vs the households which possess a gun.  As I had said, we can also look at homicide rates or violent crime rates before and after gun bans in other countries.  Not just gun deaths, but the total number of homicides;  I think you have less impact in your argument, if you are just shifting the means.

The following Chart from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_de...s_by_state shows gun murders to gun ownership.  It doesn't show the correlation that is sometimes presented. 


 

This is why my questions are; what are you trying to accomplish, what are you proposing, and why do you think it will work.    I live in rural Pennsylvania, where I would guess the percentage of households owning a gun is high, and many of them likely own a number of weapons.  Yet I would be far more comfortable walking around at night here, than in Washington DC (the dot way up high), which to my understanding has fairly strict gun control laws.

We may not always have a stable and wise leader like Trump in control, and may need to be able to stand up to the government at some point.

I'm glad someone got a chuckle out of that

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I think that some of the things that get's me, is that the case for gun control is not made well.    It's more emotional reaction than logical. Say for instance that you want to limit or get rid of automatic rifles with a large clip size.  It doesn't make sense, to cite all gun deaths, when the majority of incidences are not made with this type of weapon.  In this recent school tragedy even, that weapon may have only made a little difference.  This (in my opinion) is more of concern, when you have  a crowd, where indiscriminate fire is more effective. 

Similarly for many places which have enacted gun bans, while they did eventually minimize gun deaths, they didn't have that much effect on overall deaths.  People within a time, realized that they could kill themselves or kill others with things besides a gun.  There may be some instances where the lack of a gun will change things, but for someone who wants to kill another, the problem isn't the weapon. 

We need to be realistic about what is being proposed, and what will be the results.   Arguments that make you come off as someone who is just afraid of guns does not help.

Similarly, the "right to bear arms" shouldn't be used as a conversation stopper.   And it needs to be realistically looked at, that not all who own guns are responsible or thoughtful in their use.  Specific weapons and their availability do need to be looked at, and arguments heard.

Also of consideration is why the founders of the nation included the "right to bear arms".  This is fairly unique to the U.S. from my understanding.  We may not always have a stable and wise leader like Trump in control, and may need to be able to stand up to the government at some point.

If that is true how is it that in Romania only 300 murders happen per year ? And please don't say mentality or culture of violence because Romania's socio-economical enviroment is as fucked as a hooker at the corner.

I'm unsure.   (Also unsure to what specifically you are addressing in my posts).

But Iceland has a number of guns, and very few (none in this instance) murders by gun per 100,000 people.
There are a number of other countries, which have guns, and yet their guns seem to not jump out of their cases and kill people.  They must be nicer to their guns (or better at keeping them subservient.)

https://www.deseretnews.com/top/2519/7/S...rship.html