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Substitutionary Atonement! WTF?
#63
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF?
(June 12, 2018 at 9:10 am)Chad32 Wrote:
(June 12, 2018 at 2:08 am)Godscreated Wrote: But He has because He is the real God, the others never died so they couldn't have been risen, they are not real, they are truly the ones who are hiding away.


 How many time s must the Christians here tell everyone that God doesn't kill people for not worshiping Him. You are judged because you do not accept Jesus as your savior, when you do accept Him you will have no trouble worshiping Him. Worshiping God entails many different things and probably none of the things you would actually admit to. 
 What makes you believe He did not have to curse the world, please show me from the reference book called the Bible because that is the only place that kind of information can come from, I say He had no other choice, man left Him with only the one thing to do, you see there is choice and there are consequences to choice, good and bad.
 The Bible chronicles no such thing, it does show how humanity has failed to listen to Him and the need for a savior for everyone. By the way He did not sacrifice himself to himself, man put Jesus on the cross and killed Him in a extremely violent way. When the Jews sacrificed animals they cut the throat so the animal bleed out quickly and suffered little. Done correctly the animal can still breath and it goes to sleep, kinda' like euthanaisa except for the pain of the cut and with a very sharp knife that isn't as painful as people imagine. God has never said He was wrong because He has never been wrong, millions are saved every year.

GC

As far as anyone has concretely proven, no gods are real. Abrahamic ones, or otherwise.

Worshiping him is exactly what "accepting Jesus" means. And yes, his entire problem with Humanity is apparently that he wants to be worshiped, and is not.

It's not that He wants to be worshiped He deserves to be worshiped, He is after all the one who allowed you to wake up this morning, then enjoy a beautiful day with all the wonderful things He created. That's just for starters the list would be never ending.

Chad32 Wrote:Of course he didn't have to curse the entire world when two people disobeyed him once. It's asinine to think he had to have that much of a problem with it. Hell, that wasn't even part of the warning from before. He said they'd die that day. He didn't mention any world cursing. But instead of doing what he told them would happen, he let Adam live over 900 years, and cursed the world. Does he have control over his powers and how the world operates, or not?

You can't understand that God's creation was absolutely perfect and when Adam and Eve disobeyed they brought evil into this perfect world an evil that has slowly eaten away at this world and the people who occupy it. The curse is this, God did not stop this slow destruction, He allowed it to continue and it will until the day Christ returns. It was part of the warning because they did die, first a spiritual separation from God, then the physical death. He didn't call what was to come the "curse" per se, but I think the word death was vivid enough wouldn't you. God has complete control, He has allowed you to say all sorts of negative and vile things about Him and you're still with us. 

Chad32 Wrote:He has never had a problem with inflicting pain on third parties when someone does something he doesn't like. Killing children for the crimes of their parents isn't something he ever had to do. He just felt like doing it.

When did God kill children because of what there parents did. If you're talking about the parents sins being pass down to the third and forth generations, then you have little understanding of the scriptures and what they say. The children will suffer the same sins because the parents have taught them it's okay to do those sinful things and each generation will continue to do so. You also need to understand who God was speaking to and why and that they were warned before they said they would obey all God's commandments and worship Him only, God told them what would happen if they made and then broke their promise. God never does something just because He feels like it, that's a human weakness, God is totally responsible in what actions He takes, His omnipresence assures that if nothing else.

Chad32 Wrote:He has been wrong. Never admitting when you messed up just makes the problem worse, because it means you won't change. How you kill an innocent animal or person doesn't really matter. The fact that you're doing it at all is the messed up part.

 Who are you to judge God, you're a being that has lived for a moment in time and God has lived for an eternity, He has witnessed it all before it ever happened, He understands the outcomes and how they will effect everything. God is perfect and unchanging, this is why Christians can live a life assured God will do as He said He would do. I'm not sure where you got your disassembled ideas about God but where ever they came from you have been shown wrong and should investigate for yourself who God is.

GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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Messages In This Thread
Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by ignoramus - June 9, 2018 at 3:12 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by brewer - June 9, 2018 at 9:19 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 9, 2018 at 10:07 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by vorlon13 - June 9, 2018 at 10:15 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Simon Moon - June 9, 2018 at 1:39 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by henryp - June 9, 2018 at 1:48 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by brewer - June 9, 2018 at 2:45 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Minimalist - June 9, 2018 at 3:08 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by chimp3 - June 9, 2018 at 3:21 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 9, 2018 at 3:28 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by chimp3 - June 9, 2018 at 3:30 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by AFTT47 - June 9, 2018 at 8:48 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Wyrd of Gawd - June 9, 2018 at 10:24 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by ignoramus - June 9, 2018 at 10:39 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by The Valkyrie - June 10, 2018 at 2:52 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Wyrd of Gawd - June 10, 2018 at 3:18 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 10, 2018 at 9:08 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Huggy Bear - June 10, 2018 at 9:14 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 10, 2018 at 9:35 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Huggy Bear - June 10, 2018 at 10:02 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by AFTT47 - June 10, 2018 at 10:13 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 11, 2018 at 2:08 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 11, 2018 at 9:14 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 12, 2018 at 2:08 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 12, 2018 at 9:10 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 13, 2018 at 1:16 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 13, 2018 at 8:34 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 14, 2018 at 2:01 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 14, 2018 at 8:15 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 15, 2018 at 2:49 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 15, 2018 at 2:00 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 16, 2018 at 2:14 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Ravenshire - June 17, 2018 at 2:31 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 17, 2018 at 9:36 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 18, 2018 at 1:35 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Ravenshire - June 18, 2018 at 3:18 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 18, 2018 at 4:09 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Ravenshire - June 18, 2018 at 4:43 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 19, 2018 at 12:54 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Astreja - June 19, 2018 at 1:23 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 19, 2018 at 9:21 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 19, 2018 at 11:55 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 20, 2018 at 8:18 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Succubus - June 20, 2018 at 10:19 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 21, 2018 at 12:44 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 21, 2018 at 7:58 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Succubus - June 18, 2018 at 5:27 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by vorlon13 - June 14, 2018 at 5:01 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 15, 2018 at 12:33 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Astreja - June 18, 2018 at 1:53 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 10, 2018 at 10:27 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Wyrd of Gawd - June 10, 2018 at 2:30 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Huggy Bear - June 10, 2018 at 7:46 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by MysticKnight - June 10, 2018 at 7:59 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Wyrd of Gawd - June 10, 2018 at 8:21 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Huggy Bear - June 10, 2018 at 7:59 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Huggy Bear - June 10, 2018 at 8:47 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by brewer - June 10, 2018 at 8:50 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 10, 2018 at 9:01 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by RDK1 - June 10, 2018 at 9:21 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by brewer - June 10, 2018 at 9:25 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by brewer - June 10, 2018 at 9:19 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by RDK1 - June 10, 2018 at 9:30 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by brewer - June 10, 2018 at 10:57 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by The Grand Nudger - June 10, 2018 at 11:35 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Huggy Bear - June 11, 2018 at 7:35 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by ignoramus - June 11, 2018 at 12:08 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Huggy Bear - June 12, 2018 at 12:08 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Drich - June 12, 2018 at 10:20 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by brewer - June 14, 2018 at 11:07 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by The Grand Nudger - June 12, 2018 at 12:10 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Crossless2.0 - June 12, 2018 at 12:17 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Huggy Bear - June 12, 2018 at 1:26 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Wyrd of Gawd - June 12, 2018 at 3:11 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Crossless2.0 - June 12, 2018 at 1:53 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by The Valkyrie - June 12, 2018 at 1:55 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Crossless2.0 - June 12, 2018 at 1:58 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by The Valkyrie - June 12, 2018 at 1:57 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Crossless2.0 - June 12, 2018 at 2:06 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by The Valkyrie - June 12, 2018 at 8:13 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by robvalue - June 14, 2018 at 9:08 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 14, 2018 at 9:41 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 16, 2018 at 8:18 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by The Grand Nudger - June 20, 2018 at 12:02 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by robvalue - June 20, 2018 at 12:19 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by KevinM1 - June 20, 2018 at 2:00 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by robvalue - June 20, 2018 at 2:51 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Wyrd of Gawd - June 20, 2018 at 6:28 pm
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by The Grand Nudger - June 21, 2018 at 12:47 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 22, 2018 at 12:46 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Angrboda - June 22, 2018 at 8:48 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Chad32 - June 22, 2018 at 8:58 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Godscreated - June 23, 2018 at 2:52 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by ignoramus - June 21, 2018 at 3:18 am
RE: Substitutionary Atonement! WTF? - by Haipule - June 21, 2018 at 3:42 am

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