(June 15, 2018 at 2:00 pm)Chad32 Wrote:(June 15, 2018 at 2:49 am)Godscreated Wrote:
I don't care for eternal life, or to be judge by someone who is a bigger screwup than I am. So what if he's eternal? That means he's had all the time in the world to get things right, and still hasn't figured it out yet. How much more time are we going to give him before you stop blaming limited people, and start thinking maybe it's him? Maybe he's the problem all along.
You will have an eternal life nevertheless, the only thing now is where will you spend it. The God who created the universe did not mess-up anything, man screwed it up and man is the only one responsible. God created it perfect in six days and man screwed it up with one disobedient act, and he did so after being warned it would be costly.
Chad32 Wrote:Well think about the idea of free will. The victim didn't choose to have something bad happen. But the criminal is taking their free will away from them by forcing them to do something. And your god, who is supposed to be all present, and capable of stopping it, decides the criminal's free will is a higher priority than the victim's. This is why we say that if you see someone committing a crime, and can stop the person without risking your well being doing so, then you're partially responsible. If there's free will in heaven, it's possible for people to choose "wrongly", and get kicked out. It happened before, when a third of the population of angels decided they didn't like how god ran things, despite knowing him perfectly well. So even if I got to heaven, I doubt I'd be staying there for an eternity. I'd just be paying lip service anyway, after all.
You assume God can just step in and take care of all the world's problems, though He has that power it is not the responsible thing to do. Remember man caused his own problem and has continued down through history. If a parent bails a troubled child out every time it misbehaves and tells it it's okay you didn't mean it, that child will never change and continue in a life of misbehavior. If God bails out everyone from ever kind of bad situation then no one would ever learn to stand on their own two feet. Yes people suffer because man has free will, but it's up to the people to assert laws and punishments to stop such misbehavior. In the end that is what God will be doing, putting an end to all misbehavior. I have no idea why a third of the angels were so dumb as to believe they could over through their creator, bet they are wishing they had not listened to Lucifer knowing the results of their actions. As for your assumption that man will at some point rebel in heaven because he will have free will, what makes you believe that there will be that kind of choices and what makes you think that man who will understand how powerless they would be against the omnipotent God, we'll always have Jesus as a reminder of the price the first time around.
Chad32 Wrote:If all children go to heaven, and people were really ok with that, then we'd have a lot more people killing kids right after they said the lord's prayer, and got saved. Why take the chance that they change their mind and lose their shot. You're right that Humans wouldn't allow that to happen, because it's a sick thing to think about. Your god allowed it to happen once before, except for saving eight people, and plans to set the world on fire if you believe in the end times. He's a god of blood and death. He doesn't care about anything besides himself. You're only useful to him as a worshiper, and he will kill you and cast you aside if you refuse to do so. Which ironically makes him unworthy of worship.
See the bold above by me, this shows you have no idea what being saved is about, not a clue, you are spouting words to have an argument and nothing more. When a person is saved they do not have a license to sin and murder is a sin. If one were willfully sinning by killing children and had no remorse they were never a Christian to start with. That person could have no remorse either because they would believe they were doing a righteous thing. By the way many of the lost in this world that are murdering innocent unborn children are sending to heave a place they do not even believe in.
It's their right to decide, just as it's the right of the unborn to be born, no one has the right to take those choices from them.
Just because you can't understand who God is doesn't mean He fits your idea of who He is. You and all the atheist here need to understand this, when a person is saved they want to worship God because we understand He is worthy of worship and praise. The lost like yourself have no idea and just mumble and moan about those who choose to do so, you haven't a clue about what worship is.
Chad32 Wrote:If part of the bible is a metaphor, what's to keep us from believing the whole thing is a metaphor? Up to and including Yahweh and Jesus?
This is a tired old argument that holds no water, here's why, simply because of so many factual things that are in the Bible and that the Bible has no contradiction even though it was written by many different men separated by over a thousand years.
Chad32 Wrote:There are good arguments for killing never being good. And we both know what god thinks of thoughts that just pop up from time to time. That they're apparently as bad as actions. Jealousy stems from low self esteem. Because apparently he doesn't like competing with fake gods, and doesn't think too hard about why Humans would rather worship fake gods than the real one.
When did I say that killing was good, you're trying to paint me in a light that isn't true. Jesus never said anything about thoughts, Jesus was speaking about those who would give serious contemplation of sinful things such as murder. You and the rest of the atheist sure have sorry reasoning skill, especially sad when I think of how you all brag about your skills as reasoners are so much better than that of Christians.
Who taught you jealousy stems from low self esteem, people are jealous for many reasons that have nothing to do with their self esteem. God understands what worshiping false gods does for/to people, He understands that they will make their own moral codes that are harmful to them and society as a whole. God is our creator and is right in expecting us to be grateful enough to worship Him. Like the Bible says men who follow after false gods do so because of their own desire to sin against the God who created them. I do not know whether you're a father or not, but if you are how would you feel if your child gave the telephone pole out on the street a gift on Sunday and said all hail to you my father tele-pole. Bet that would ruin Father's Day for you, if you are a father that is and I bet jealousy would rage in you in that moment, especially knowing you were a good and faithful father.
Chad32 Wrote:Yes, NK is a bad place, and a lot of bad things happen, but for some people, especially those who worship Kimmy, sometimes good things happen. Step out of line, and he'll have you killed or make you disappear, but if you grovel to him enough, he might favor you and give you something nice. That's the same deal with Yahweh. Except we can meet Kim, and prove he exists rather easily.
Her's where you're wrong, worshiping Kim want even get the people a decent meal (which is a basic human right), let lone something nice. God provides for the lost and saved the same. When it rains on the fields in rains on both, when the sun shines on the fields it shines on both, God is not in the business of playing favorites, but He will do extra for those who will ask, something to think about.
GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
