RE: Evil Atheists
September 19, 2011 at 3:14 pm
(This post was last modified: September 19, 2011 at 3:16 pm by Carnavon.)
(September 19, 2011 at 2:22 pm)ElDinero Wrote: Firstly, people boast about being saved all the time. Secondly, are you saying atheists can make it into heaven? If yes, I don't think you'd find much agreement from Christians on that point, and it makes belief in God superfluous. If not, then worship is being valued over actions, which is a crock of shit.If they boast about being saved, I will question their authenticity. The Bible is very clear that we have nothing to boast about and any real Christian will know in his/her heart that their lives are not what it should be. Being saved is a gift and it is really funny for anybody claiming merit when receiving a gift undeservedly. Grace is unmerited favour. So boasting is excluded.
The question of how we arrive at a moral standard is by evaluation of current practices, discussion, debate, enquiry and consideration of potential better paths to take. It's exactly the same way you do, but you exclaim 'GOD GAVE US OUR MORALITY' even though it's demonstrably untrue that it comes from the Bible.
Will atheists make it into heaven? All I was saying is that we are all deserving of eternal damnation and no "good works" can change that. We are all imperfect.
If an atheist is convinced in his/her heart of his/her own sinfulness and realise that their only hope of being made right with God is through the blood of Jesus Christ, repent, and make Jesus Lord of their lives, then they will be saved. Based on their lives, they deserve hell - as we all do.
The question remains what you use as guideline on which is "better". Why?
I accept the Bible as the Word of God in which He gives me guidelines for my life. I am going out on a bit of a limb here, but it seems to me that morality cannot be "legislated". It is a state of the heart. The purpose of the law in the Bible (e.g Ten Commandments) is to reveal sin and not to make us holy. Human judgement is very subjective and as the Bible states "the heart is deceitful above all things". You will also know that sometimes even our best actions may be questioned whether it is our own ego's that we want to bolster or is it for the better for the suposed "beneficiary" of our actions.
Have a great day ( here in RSA, it is now night time)
(September 19, 2011 at 2:29 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: Religion is not required for morals to be established. Chimpanzees live in troops and interact, as do all social animals, mostly they display behaviour that conforms to the norm and get along this is a sort of 'morality', behaviour that does not harm the others in the troop, tribe,whoop or whatever. Behaving morally is a social lubricant, it eases relationships and lessens conflict. That is why moral behaviour has evolved in many social species at many different times.I suppose one could ask where does this behaviour come from?
Quote:Though animals may not possess moral behavior, all social animals have had to modify or restrain their behaviors for group living to be worthwhile. Typical examples of behavioral modification can be found in the societies ants, bees and termites. Ant colonies may possess millions of individuals. E. O. Wilson argues that the single most important factor that leads to the success of ant colonies is the existence of a sterile worker caste. This caste of females are subservient to the needs of their mother, the queen, and in so doing, have given up their own reproduction in order to raise brothers and sisters. The existence of sterile castes among these social insects, significantly restricts the competition for mating and in the process fosters cooperation within a colony. Cooperation among ants is vital, because a solitary ant has an improbable chance of long term survival and reproduction. However as part of a group, colonies can thrive for decades. As a consequence, ants are one of the most successful species on the planet, accounting for a biomass that rivals humans.[1][2]
The basic reason that social animals live in groups is that opportunities for survival and reproduction are much better in groups than living alone. The social behaviors of mammals are more familiar to humans. Highly social mammals such as primates and elephants have been known to exhibit traits that were once thought to be uniquely human, like empathy and altruism.