(September 14, 2018 at 8:08 am)polymath257 Wrote:(September 14, 2018 at 7:52 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: Again, you seem to be confusing language with the external reality of things. If there are 4 trees, then there is four tree's. Whether you or anyone else knows it, and if you incorrectly count 5 tree's. Even in your argument here, you appeal to an objective reality outside of the subject. I would agree, that there is a subjective component to our observations, and our understanding. But that relates to an external objective reality. As you keep appealing to yourself. I don't disagree, that we can be incorrect, or that we may call it different things (due to the conventions of language). These things do not make something ontologically subjective.
Suppose I have four plants and you consider one to be a tree and I consider that one to be a bush. You would say there are four trees and I would say there are three. And we could both be correct. The method of counting is the mathematical model: how to apply the abstract language to a particular real world situation. The reality didn't change: it was only our interpretation that differs.
Here you are arguing that they are ontologically objective. The number of things did not change and was not effected by the subject or their opinions. We are describing something external and not internal to the subject.
It is said that an argument is what convinces reasonable men and a proof is what it takes to convince even an unreasonable man. - Alexander Vilenkin
If I am shown my error, I will be the first to throw my books into the fire. - Martin Luther
If I am shown my error, I will be the first to throw my books into the fire. - Martin Luther