On Hell and Forgiveness

[polymath257]

---

You do, however, need a partial order that has a largest element. The problem is that 'greater' isn't well defined. Even if it were, there is no reason to think there is a greatest element.

So, at the very least, you need a consistent definition of 'greater'. Since there is more than one variable on which you want to measure (power, goodness, knowledge, etc), you have to find a consistent way to guarantee a maximum on each variable at the same time. This is usually impossible, even when each individual variable has a largest element.

Nope. Concerning God, the concept of 'greatest' does not require us to know what is actually the greatest. You are confusing ontology with epistemology.

Yep. Without a definite concept of 'greater', there is nothing else that can be concluded. For example, does your version of 'greater' actually have a 'greatest' element? Not all partial orders do. Some have maximal elements (none greater) that are not 'greatest' (all lesser). That depends on whether you have a linear order. But it is very far from clear that there is a well defined linear order that merges all the characteristics you seem to want to lump into a deity.

You want to claim the existence of a greatest. But a greatest need not exist for most partial orders. Even for linear orders there may not be a greatest.

So, you are just ducking the central issue: what does it mean to be greater in this context? How do you know there must be a greatest in that definition of greater? How do you know there isn't more than one 'maximal'? All of these are very relevant questions that need to be addressed *first*, before any claims of existence can be demonstrated.