RE: On Hell and Forgiveness
September 30, 2018 at 6:34 pm
(This post was last modified: September 30, 2018 at 6:35 pm by GrandizerII.)
(September 30, 2018 at 9:38 am)SteveII Wrote: Why would he do such a thing? If only the passage explained it...oh wait:
Quote:32 They went to a place called Gethsemane, and Jesus said to his disciples, “Sit here while I pray.” 33 He took Peter, James and John along with him, and he began to be deeply distressed and troubled. 34 “My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow to the point of death,” he said to them. “Stay here and keep watch.”
35 Going a little farther, he fell to the ground and prayed that if possible the hour might pass from him. 36 “Abba,[f] Father,” he said, “everything is possible for you. Take this cup from me. Yet not what I will, but what you will.”
37 Then he returned to his disciples and found them sleeping. “Simon,” he said to Peter, “are you asleep? Couldn’t you keep watch for one hour? 38 Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak.”
39 Once more he went away and prayed the same thing. 40 When he came back, he again found them sleeping, because their eyes were heavy. They did not know what to say to him.
41 Returning the third time, he said to them, “Are you still sleeping and resting? Enough! The hour has come. Look, the Son of Man is delivered into the hands of sinners. 42 Rise! Let us go! Here comes my betrayer!”
Apparently having the sins of the entire world about to be put on your shoulders has an effect. Who would have thought!
An effect that involves fear of suffering. You went back a few verses to look for the words you wanted, but how about you try to translate Mark 14:36 in light of your interpretation that it was just sorrow. Was Jesus simply just too sorrowful to want to suffer for humankind?
"Oh, I'm not scared or anything, but it gives me much sorrow to have to suffer for others!"
Yeah, right. How about you check this quote from John Calvin on this passage:
Quote:Christ, amidst fear and sadness, was weak without any taint of sin.
Quote:Well, you failed at showing Jesus showed fear, so isn't this all moot?
That's mainstream Christian teaching, Steve. It's not my personal interpretation. You think you have it all figured out, do you?
If Jesus showed fear, then this means fear and consequently bravery becomes relevant when it comes to God's "great-making" properties. Since your God saw it fit to experience various weaknesses in human flesh, all these weaknesses should become a matter of consideration in deciding what makes for divine greatness. You can no longer argue that your God does not experience fear if he can indeed do so (according to your favorite book).
