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Creation Museum
#60
RE: Creation Museum
(September 23, 2011 at 9:51 pm)Castle Wrote: Where in that letter did Einstein claim he is an atheist.
...
In fact where did Einstein write, show me one thing where Einstein claimed he is an atheist. Other than what atheists for obvious reason, claimed him as an atheist.
Here:
Quote:The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.
Not believing and/or worshipping a god makes one an atheist. Do you want bolder text with your bold text? Larger font with exclamation marks? I think I can arrange that.

And he never "claimed" it dummy, which is irrelevant as he gradually deconverted from Judaism anyway. Something theists cannot accept to this day. I don't care. Einstein stated his ever-changing position with many eponymous articles on the subject. Indeed overtime he went from being an agnostic theist in the 1930s where he shared the belief system of a deist or verging on pantheism, to an agnostic atheist in 50s, towards the end of his life.

The media and press had a "fit" at this revelation. They made many attempts to take the writings out of context and present Albert Einstein as this “conventionally religious man”. Einstein was popular, atheists were not. Einstein therefore had to repeatedly address the issue time and again. It was never enough for some disingenuous tools out there though. This was an extract from one of his letters written on 24th March 1954:
Quote:It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly.


Quote:...No wonder, again I'm given this mainly greatest atheist in human history lists, where many great men not self proclaim atheist.
This is illegible... I'm sorry but you're just not making enough sense with this sentence here for me to respond to. Try again.


Quote:Itt, not in your letter, he dislike for Monolithically religions, like myself and even much mush greater Dawkins. For most part I think much the same as Einstein said, that he believed in a pantheistic God (a god that is the universe), his comments and statements admitting creation and divine thought better describe a theistic god.”
No. Interviews published in 1930 within G. S. Viereck's book "Glimpses of the Great" had Einstein explaining he did not consider himself to be a pantheist. A lot changed since then.


Quote:In conclusion, Einstein was not an atheist, and did not claim to be an atheist because did not know who God was.
No in conclusion Castle you are a tool. Again you confuse the very separate issues of what atheism and agnosticism are addressing. In his last days Einstein made it transparently clear he did not believe in any god, indeed he thought the label "god" was utterly meaningless.

Now if you don't believe in a single deity or deities you are by default, an atheist, whether you accept that term/label or not is irrelevant. I'm sorry but you can't have both. Not knowing with absolute certainty if there is an unseen god-like being somewhere in the cosmos or who created the universe (which is a red herring when we're talking in the context of practical meaningful knowledge) still makes one an atheist, specifically an agnostic atheist or weak atheist. They don't believe there is a god, but don't profess there is no god. Its existence is 'unknowable' in the context in which its being used here.


Quote:Nevertheless, he believed in God but not a personal god.
Here we go again. >_>

In the late 20s yes, he identified an affiliation with Spinoza's God concept, believing God exists and is abstract and impersonal. He thereby denied freewill also, a move which "pissed off" a lot of his Christian colleagues and Jewish friends.

Later on, he *rejected* the concept of a deity altogether as childish nonsense - the total sum of human weaknesses and superstition.

You see, as a Jewish National, Einstein was intentionally ambiguous about his beliefs and personal thoughts on God, religion, mysticism, and spirituality. He never openly proclaimed his lack of belief in monotheistic religions to start with because being called an "Atheist" back then was akin to being called a "bastard", if not worse. He'd be denounced by all his associates and acquaintances. It's easy for someone well versed in English or German to misunderstand his very enigmatic views and words in these and philosophy. Just like with Charles Darwin, it's a common theist tactic whenever building up straw man argument or making an appeal to authority (like what you're doing right now) to try and fallaciously quote mine Einstein's work and writings out of context, distorting its intended meaning.

None of this should matter. Although a brilliant physicist and scientist, Einstein was wrong about a lot of things. For instance he couldn't wrap his head around quantum mechanics. Albert Einstein was human like the rest of us, and was susceptible to peer pressure. He was a great thinker but not infallible and liable of intellectual dishonesty.

Einstein was an 'arsehole' with regards to his intellectual honesty on his religious views. He declared he believed in no god, yet rejected atheism. He had a mental block that allowed him to conflate strong atheism with weak atheism over and over again. Worse still he denigrated disbelievers, calling us all 'fanatical', which was wrong of him. Though his work on relativity was groundbreaking, on the subject of belief in god or gods, Einstein was a hypocrite in this regard.

Not just him but all humans are capable of cruelty and behaving like arseholes toward their fellow man (or men). Take the inventor Nikola Tesla for example; he was a Serbian Orthodox Christian. Like Einstein I don't really care what his beliefs or disbeliefs were, because I have nothing but respect for his work within commercial electricity, engineering and developments in the field of electromagnetism. He was a genius. As brilliant as innovative minds come. Yet like Einstein, he had his prejudices and shortcomings too. Nikola suffered from obsessive-compulsive-disorder. He would openly express disgust for people who were overweight, attacking women's attire, and harshly mocking others hygiene. Sadly, he went senile before he died. The rest as they say, is history.

Einstein was an atheist, whether you like it or not. And so what Castle if he died an atheist after all? What difference does that make for atheism or theism? What weight does that add to the argument of there being a creator entity out there? Why does this bother you so? Because then you'd have to put him in the same boat as Richard Dawkins? A humanist and freethinker whom you despise with no good reason? Really?

And I'm still waiting for proof that Einstein was a spiritualist by the way.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Creation Museum - by Castle - September 22, 2011 at 4:01 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 22, 2011 at 4:46 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Zen Badger - September 22, 2011 at 7:14 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Welsh cake - September 22, 2011 at 7:19 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 22, 2011 at 11:46 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Cyberman - September 22, 2011 at 11:24 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 22, 2011 at 9:36 am
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 22, 2011 at 9:42 am
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 22, 2011 at 10:06 am
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 22, 2011 at 11:54 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 22, 2011 at 12:50 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Simon Moon - September 23, 2011 at 2:42 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 4:44 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 4:54 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 5:25 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by downbeatplumb - September 22, 2011 at 12:49 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Welsh cake - September 22, 2011 at 7:27 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 22, 2011 at 10:37 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 2:57 am
RE: Creation Museum - by jmayerfan - September 22, 2011 at 11:34 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 1:26 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Minimalist - September 23, 2011 at 1:31 am
RE: Creation Museum - by jmayerfan - September 26, 2011 at 8:32 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 23, 2011 at 4:25 am
RE: Creation Museum - by jmayerfan - September 23, 2011 at 9:30 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Zen Badger - September 24, 2011 at 7:35 am
RE: Creation Museum - by R-e-n-n-a-t - September 23, 2011 at 9:45 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Welsh cake - September 23, 2011 at 7:11 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 11:33 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Welsh cake - September 23, 2011 at 6:45 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 9:51 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 23, 2011 at 10:04 am
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 23, 2011 at 12:10 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 1:23 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 1:47 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 1:35 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 1:38 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Jackalope - September 23, 2011 at 4:55 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 5:01 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 23, 2011 at 2:23 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 3:24 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Faith No More - September 23, 2011 at 4:03 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 23, 2011 at 5:11 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Faith No More - September 23, 2011 at 5:49 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 6:12 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 23, 2011 at 9:16 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 24, 2011 at 1:52 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 24, 2011 at 3:05 am
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 23, 2011 at 5:16 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Ace Otana - September 23, 2011 at 5:30 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 5:35 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Faith No More - September 23, 2011 at 6:15 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 8:05 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Ace Otana - September 23, 2011 at 8:13 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 23, 2011 at 8:18 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 23, 2011 at 9:25 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 23, 2011 at 9:41 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by jmayerfan - September 26, 2011 at 11:17 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 27, 2011 at 5:40 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Minimalist - September 23, 2011 at 10:15 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by KichigaiNeko - September 24, 2011 at 7:06 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 24, 2011 at 11:48 am
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 24, 2011 at 8:39 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Welsh cake - September 24, 2011 at 9:04 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 24, 2011 at 2:59 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 25, 2011 at 10:55 am
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 24, 2011 at 12:22 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 24, 2011 at 12:37 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 24, 2011 at 12:40 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Welsh cake - September 24, 2011 at 1:01 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 24, 2011 at 3:00 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Cyberman - September 25, 2011 at 1:49 am
RE: Creation Museum - by R-e-n-n-a-t - September 25, 2011 at 5:44 am
RE: Creation Museum - by downbeatplumb - September 25, 2011 at 9:57 am
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 25, 2011 at 1:20 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 25, 2011 at 1:46 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Faith No More - September 25, 2011 at 3:05 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 25, 2011 at 10:51 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 25, 2011 at 11:20 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Minimalist - September 26, 2011 at 9:32 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by jmayerfan - September 26, 2011 at 11:27 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by ElDinero - September 26, 2011 at 9:35 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by subhendusc - September 26, 2011 at 11:21 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by Minimalist - September 26, 2011 at 11:26 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 27, 2011 at 12:41 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Minimalist - September 27, 2011 at 12:50 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 27, 2011 at 10:33 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Rokcet Scientist - September 27, 2011 at 8:50 pm
RE: Creation Museum - by The Grand Nudger - September 27, 2011 at 11:06 am
RE: Creation Museum - by Castle - September 27, 2011 at 10:20 pm

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