RE: The Jesus story has details that is most definitely made up i just realized!!!
September 20, 2019 at 10:03 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 6:00 pm)mordant Wrote:(September 19, 2019 at 11:50 am)Jehanne Wrote: I neglected to mention Paul, in what are universally recognized by scholars in his 7 authentic New Testament epistles, also mentions Jesus.
Paul has a very different conception from the gospels, of a celestial Jesus, revealed and informed not via an earthly ministry or the testimony of what should have been then-living eyewitnesses, but a heavenly vision or dream -- claimed direct revelation to him personally.
There was no established orthodoxy for Christianity in the 1st century. The gospels, written more than a generation after Paul's letters even if we accept the most common dating, were an attempt to codify such an orthodoxy. But it would take about 300 more years for it to triumph, in particular over gnosticism. Indeed, I wouldn't be surprised if Paul was an early gnostic or even the originator of the concept.
Finally ... if the gospels are the claim and not the evidence, so is the rest of the NT including Paul's writings. The Acts of the Apostles references Jesus too. So what? All that stuff is fabulist fan fiction. What is needed is independent, preferably hostile, secular sources referencing Jesus. What we have is a forged "pious fraud" in Josephus and stuff like Tacitus that refers to the cult, not its leader.
Paul, in the 7 epistles that are undisputed as having been written by him, refers to some actions of the historical Jesus -- namely, his last meal, betrayal and crucifixion. But, yes, for Paul, Jesus' "resurrection" was mostly, if not wholly, spiritual. In fact, Paul may have believed that Jesus' corpse was buried and he was resurrected in some sort of phantasmal body.