Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: July 21, 2025, 6:02 pm

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Atheist VS Naturalist - the latter sounds more appealing to me...
RE: Atheist VS Naturalist - the latter sounds more appealing to me...
(May 30, 2020 at 9:16 pm)Belacqua Wrote:
(May 30, 2020 at 8:33 pm)polymath257 Wrote: If a frog is singing, that is part of what it 'is or does' and therefore part of its nature, right?

If science told us in great detail and with great confidence that a frog can't sing Italian duets [i.e., that such singing is not a part of the frog's nature], and yet we saw it do so, then people who are open to the possibility of the supernatural would take this as evidence of the supernatural.

Science would not make such a proclamation. It *never* dictates what is the 'nature' of something (except, potentially, in definitions--always subject to further investigation).

If we actually *see* frogs singing duets, then that is raw information and 'science' would say it is possible for frogs to sing duets, but we don't know how. That would be an opportunity for investigation. But, the observation of singing by a frog would *show* that singing is in that frog's nature.

Quote:People who are not open to the possibility of the supernatural would assume that science hadn't discovered something yet. That in fact it was part of the frog's nature. Even if a million years went by and no explanation was offered, people who are not open to the possibility of the supernatural would continue to assume this. 

For clarity: I am not saying that it's possible.

And, once again, BY YOUR DEFINITION, the 'nature' of something is what it is and does. So, if a frog sings duets, it is in it nature to sing duets because that is what it is *doing*.

The *start* of science is observation. So, if a frog is observed to sing duets, then that is what science *starts* with. You seem to think it starts with some sort of materialist assumption, BUT THAT IS WRONG. It starts with observation. THEN, it makes hypotheses about what is observed. It makes sure those hypotheses are testable, and then it ACTUALLY TESTS them. It will try to default to using previously tested ideas to formulate the hypotheses, but at ALL stages, the observation is the focus.

So, in your little scenario, the scientists would NOT say it is impossible for a frog to sing. They would observe it singing and start with that information, proceeding to try to figure out how it is possible.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
RE: Atheist VS Naturalist - the latter sounds more appealing to me... - by polymath257 - May 31, 2020 at 10:19 am

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Is life more satisfying as an atheist or religionist? FrustratedFool 96 11431 November 10, 2023 at 11:13 pm
Last Post: Thumpalumpacus
  No soul? No free will and no responsibility then, yet the latter's essential... Duty 33 6233 August 26, 2020 at 4:35 pm
Last Post: HappySkeptic
  His wish sounds familiar purplepurpose 1 1153 November 16, 2017 at 4:55 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Ugh, how come I, an atheist, have the ability to ACT more "Christian" than...... maestroanth 7 2224 April 9, 2016 at 7:46 pm
Last Post: Edwardo Piet
  Religious kids more likely to be cunts than atheist ones Napoléon 12 3476 November 6, 2015 at 5:50 pm
Last Post: paulpablo
  More atheist men than women? Catholic_Lady 203 42713 July 9, 2015 at 9:12 pm
Last Post: Thumpalumpacus
  Are Deists more like theists or Atheist? Twisted 37 11281 May 28, 2015 at 10:18 am
Last Post: comet
  Why do I find mysticism so appealing? JaceDeanLove 22 8144 December 24, 2014 at 10:39 pm
Last Post: Mystic
  Do we need more Atheist books for kids? process613 43 10277 November 30, 2014 at 4:14 am
Last Post: fr0d0
  Panpsychism is not as crazy as it sounds. Mudhammam 64 21722 May 18, 2014 at 4:25 pm
Last Post: Mudhammam



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)