RE: The absurd need for logical proofs for God
November 22, 2020 at 4:11 pm
(This post was last modified: November 22, 2020 at 4:20 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 22, 2020 at 2:04 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: On a side note I would like to hear someone's thoughts on the equivalence between the existence of other minds and the existence of God. A result established recently by Plantinga and others. If one has enough "belief" to think there is an outside world and creatures like himself, this exact inference from a sample of the size of a singleton (only himself) to the entire human population is what he should apply to the orderly things around him to reach a supreme being.
Sure, np. First, let's ask if anyone actually established the equality of the concepts.
An atheist believes that.....
1-they have a mind.
2-there is an external world.
3-there are other minds.
A theist believes.....
1-they have a mind.
2-there is an external world.
3-there are other minds.
4-at least one of those minds is a god.
Nope. Looks like there's an additional commitment, right off the bat. That 4th commitment is a doozy - no matter how you intend to rationalize it.
I can tell that you're struggling with this...but...if it helps...you don't need an argument for a gods existence. You wouldn't be the only person on earth doing something for reasons that you cant explain in a strictly rational way....though, I have to say......most of the things that believers point to god for are much easier to establish some other (and explicitly rational) way. It's one of those things where two people who love hotdogs have different reasons or no reason at all for handing out free hotdogs...but....... either way, people are getting hotdogs.
We establish the existence of minds, for example, by reference to behavior. By "we" I mean all of us, even you. You believe that some aspect of this world demonstrates that a god engaged in a specific and recognizable behavior. An act of creation, for example. Interdiction, for another. I could go on, but, we following?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
