RE: What's your opinion on Liberal Religion?
November 21, 2021 at 3:13 am
(This post was last modified: November 21, 2021 at 3:32 am by emjay.)
(November 21, 2021 at 2:05 am)Belacqua Wrote:(November 21, 2021 at 1:07 am)emjay Wrote: Just out of curiosity, how do you come to that conclusion? If you just mean that Christianity would be resistant to the implications, then I have no doubt, as it resists everything, but if you mean it would somehow be convincing evidence for theism, I personally can't see how (hence the question)... it certainly wouldn't convince me, and indeed would be the final nail in the coffin of any potential Christian belief in me.
Basically that is and always has been my own biggest question in all of this... if the mind is 100% dependent on the brain, or more specifically for me, if all conscious states are neurally represented in the brain... then all mental processes are therefore shown to be deterministic and/or quantum (however that applies if it does) but either way not compatible with the idea of a disembodied soul or free will. Being a hard determinist (hence my avatar) and a materialist it should be obvious that I strongly suspect that to be the case, but I don't know it to be the case... it remains an open question for me; ie if it turns out there's anything in consciousness that can't be explained by the brain, even theoretically... ie suggesting that consciousness is somehow above and beyond brain function rather than being a representation/mirror of it, as I believe it to be... then all bets would off at that point, and I'd have to rethink everything.
But to be clear, I don't expect to get the answer to those sorts of questions here... and it certainly wouldn't come from any claimed experience of people (ie NDEs, visions etc)... that's not what I'm talking about... that's content and reasonably explainable by appeal to brain states... what I'm talking about is mechanisms and theory, which can only be answered, for me, by psychology/neuroscience, and that's a long term question.
So yeah, that's where I stand on this, but just curious what you meant.
Is it your experience that most Christians base their religion on issues such as the mind/body problem?
Or is it more of a sociological phenomenon, involving behavior, ethics, and goals?
Right, I think I see what you're saying. Firstly that's the relevant issue for me as a potential Christian but I grant that like you say (or seem to be saying) many Christians would have other reasons for their belief... or have different priorities... but I would still think it would - or should - be a cause of cognitive dissonance; something that would need to be resolved not just suppressed. But I suppose you could just be saying in answer to my question, rather cynically, that it would be little different than other cases of Christianity where you'd think there would be massive amounts of cognitive dissonance, such as a creationist confronting evidence of evolution, but in practice they seem remarkably resistant to it. I have to say, I don't know if that's what you mean or not... you said somewhere else that you're not religious, but you certainly seem to be... ie are you atheist, agnostic, or is 'not religious' just another way of saying 'non-denominational Christian', like Neo?
ETA: I think I further see what you may mean, just in the sense that those sorts of questions might not even be on some people's radar, but I think the same points would still hold in the sense that once there's enough awareness about an issue, it becomes harder to ignore it... even if you were completely ignorant of it beforehand.