(November 22, 2021 at 2:37 pm)Alan V Wrote: First of all, I see "determined or random" as a false dichotomy.
So, you are suggesting that there is a 3 rd state. Explain to me how the 3 rd state operates.
“Humans also "fill in the blanks" to interpret situations without enough information (like you are doing), and choose between frames of reference so they have a better idea which algorithms to apply to which situations. Also, humans create their own programs.”
Quote:Humans also "fill in the blanks" to interpret situations without enough information (like you are doing), and choose between frames of reference so they have a better idea which algorithms to apply to which situations. Also, humans create their own programs.
This is not a 3 rd state. We use our logic and fill in blanks where it is appropriate. Humans are simply a far more sophisticated program than a Win XP.
Quote:Second, even if all humans were in fact determined, they had to be determined by something else.
The human brain takes input from reality, it learns from reality. We also learn from our peers.
The human brain’s circuits are plastic.
A program like Win XP is static but neural based algorithms are designed to learn.
Yes, when a baby is born, its brain is initialized to a certain state. The brain is not a total blank like your hard drive or RAM that you buy from the store.
Quote:A God is in a different, unique category altogether. To be all-powerful, he must be self-determining. Otherwise there must be another God behind such a "God," just as there are people behind robots.
I have the same request. Explain to me how this 3 rd state operates.
Quote:So my correction, given what you pointed out, is that a God must be able to make free-will choices. I don't see the whole-natural-world-God-of-pantheism doing that. It isn't the simplest explanation for what we see around us.
I’m not sure what people mean by free will.
A brain that is totally non-deterministic will not work just like a universe that has no particular rules is totally random and will not work. You need rules, properties in a universe so that it functions a certain way, so that you end up with stars that produce more complex elements, which eventually lead to planets.
For the brain, it needs to work in a certain way, it needs to be logically and this means having rules, having circuits, which means it is deterministic.