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How much pain can atheists withstand ?
RE: How much pain can atheists withstand ?
(May 12, 2023 at 2:13 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote:
(May 12, 2023 at 2:08 pm)The End of Atheism Wrote: Morality that comes from a being who has access to all the facts, is objective by definition. 

Another one that just doesn't know better.  Moralities that come from gods (or any other subject) are, by definition, subjective.  

Furthermore, having access to all facts would not by itself satisfy the criteria of a moral actor.  I could have access to all the facts about a poison and it's effect on people, and that wouldn't make my poisoning someone objectively moral.  For there to be an objective morality there must be moral facts.  For a competent actor to be deemed moral it must also adhere to whatever those facts are.

I will borrow from William Lane Craig on this morality from God being subjective because he puts it so eloquently.

"You argue that a God who possesses subjective feelings cannot be the foundation of objective moral values. But this is confused. I’ve argued that objective moral values are rooted in God's nature, not in His will, and that that nature expresses itself toward us in the form of divine commandments, which constitute our moral duties. God may have subjective feelings, but these are not the basis of moral value or obligation. Far from being incompatible with objective moral values and duties, subjective feelings like compassion, moral indignation, sympathy, and so on are actually part of being a perfectly good moral agent.

I suspect that the problem is that you don’t share some of the moral feelings ascribed to God and so reject His being the foundation of morality. But then you find yourself in a rather peculiar situation. For you’ve told us that you don’t think objective moral values and duties exist. So why the indignation about a jealous, vengeful, and self-absorbed God? On your view there’s nothing wrong with having such feelings! On your view the only objection to theistic morality must be a consistency objection, that theistic-based morality is somehow inconsistent. I can’t help but suspect that, in fact, you do believe in objective moral values after all."
We are not made happy by what we acquire but by what we appreciate.
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Messages In This Thread
RE: How much pain can atheists withstand ? - by Astreja - May 13, 2023 at 12:13 am
RE: How much pain can atheists withstand ? - by no one - May 3, 2023 at 10:24 am
RE: How much pain can atheists withstand ? - by h4ym4n - May 13, 2023 at 4:22 am
RE: How much pain can atheists withstand ? - by Kingpin - May 12, 2023 at 12:52 pm
RE: How much pain can atheists withstand ? - by Kingpin - May 12, 2023 at 2:25 pm

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