(May 12, 2023 at 3:13 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Yeah, you know those leading atheist philosophers, always going on and on about how there are no clinching arguments against theism.
Quote:you can't coherently define what's good outside the religious framework, maybe we can even say that good is exactly what God does, without being incoherent. With this defintiion, it doesn't seem to me that there is a dilemma.No dilemma for subjective moral systems, no. In fact, that would be a textbook example of a subjective morality. Good is whatever a given subject does.
Looks like you're playing word games. If you're right, then it's no clear how one would define objective morality. You said somewhere above that there are "moral facts", but the theist can easily retort that you don't have any way to assess whether some fact is right or wrong.
Is cutting off someone's leg right or wrong ? impossible to say without access to a reasonable set of known facts. As the set of known facts gets bigger, our moral assessment keeps changing, ad infinitum.
Is murder wrong? Yes, but it's entailed in the word murder: unjustified killing, it's analytic. A synthetic moral assessment of facts is always limited by how much we know.