RE: Maybe controversial - Religion IS bad, but.....
June 24, 2025 at 8:47 am
(This post was last modified: June 24, 2025 at 9:25 am by arewethereyet.)
@Fake Messiah
Ah the Vatican. One person tells me they are incredibly rich. The next person tells me they've been sued into bankruptcy, and got no money, yay.
Now the vatican is a small place crammed with old buildings. Whatever that is worth. Did you say they built a castle there? Another country?
I understand the pope has a vacation residence but I hadn't heard he was building castles, and I've heard plenty about them.
I'm sure they have money.
I was a foolish catholic when I was young and saw the priest buy a car with parish money. I do not know how many cars the higher ups buy.
The higher ups hobnob with the rich and powerful so I wouldn't be suprised if they bought some nice cars.
Now I've seen Jewelry used for church services and some official occasions, but I'm not aware of the higher ups having great stores of jewelry.
Everybody says the Vatican has a lot of treasure, however I don't think you can dump so many treasures all in one year.
The luxury market for it would not be able to obsorb so many expensive religious Tokens and paintings, etc. when there's plenty of luxury goods already.
Further, many of their 'treasures' are dusty old doocuments. Limited market for those too. A little down the post I talk about church $ anyways.
Most of the non-document treasures are placed in museums for the public. Yeah they could be sold.
Most of the church is lay people, priests, nuns etc. Proportionally there aren't that many higher ups. That limited number of people are hogging vast sums?
In addition to having their grubby hands on museum pieces? Is the church just paying its common workers ridiculous sums?
Catholic charitiies is the largest religious charity in the world. The church dumps big money into it every year, plus money into it's many other smaller charities.
How much $ in catholic charities? 4.5 billion, world wide. Look it up. Surely they keep that $ too. How does that compare to the $800 million you say the government gives it.
Sure they don't need government $, Is the government $ being kept or thrown in with the rest of the charity money? Where are they keeping all these treasures
they buy every year for going on what a thousand years now? Do they just keep all that the money in the bank? Sitting there every year, accumulating interest.
So they can buy a castle now and then? They must own the banks by now. A conspiracy? They are not saving vast sums they're spending it?
Where's the investigative reporters when we need them, the brave Atheist to expose them. The church is suppressing the free press on top of it? Conspiracy again?
Yeah they got money. how much? Why hasn't yearly compound interest made them richer than you say they are? The, few church hierarchy really spend so much every freaking week
that the bank accounts don't increase. Wow. Yeah they spend money innefficiently. A convention here a vacation there and the great sums of $ are gone?
Is it that the church is so rich or is it they spend their money inefficiently.
Maybe the 150 Billion they spend on hospitals and colleges is a waste. The few church leaders are keeping more than the 150 billion the hospitals and colleges get for themselves? Spending it? Saving it?
All that money hogged by the few church hierarchy, and still billions left for the charity? And the secular organisations? Less than $500 million for Oxfam, for example.
Damn the church is wealthier than god. Perhaps someone wants to say that on top of all that 'vast' money they already have, they keep the charity money?
Have you considered the possibility that they already spend far far more than they could get selling their museum pieces.
Now lets talk about how you say they should put the money into poor countries. As if they never do.
The great, majority of these countries are controlled by dictators, communists. You want the church to pump lots of $ into them.
Do you know how hard it is to dump money into such corrupt countries. Your secular u.s. government does it and we know how that turns out.
How do you think they should deal with it when the dictator comes down on them because the church helped that tribe or race the dictator especially loves to
suppress or genocide? When he starts killing the christians in the country because he doesn't like the church's interference? Oh well let them kill, its about giving $.
There are plenty of other problems that come with operating in corrupt dictatorships, working around communists.
For example working in the middle of one of their many wars. How about the poor muslim majority countries, who will kill them on even a rumor that they preached jesus.
Think the money will help fix it? Would you love to critisize the church for paying off dictators?
Maybe they should send a joke of a force - the vatican guards - with guns to force the charity on the country?
I'm not saying its all hard for the church but when considering issues like this it's best to at least try some perspective.
The christians love to repeat to each other and Us there dumbest arguements. Tho, all their arguments are dumb.
They never think it through or do their research. I feels like I'm getting a dumb Vatican arguement that's repeated again and again by atheists.
Should I just accept it? Like christians do their arguments?
Now about secular programs. I tried food stamps when I was down. Do you know you have to be employed,
or else a unemployed woman with children to get food stamps? I couldn't. You said Medicaid, It doesn't pay everything, which doesn't help if your unemployed.
My mother needed to purchase second insurance with medicaid to just to pay her cancer bills.
and then, taxes. I think the churches should pay taxes. But you haven't even demonstrated say, that they pocket the money. For all I know, the
money they save goes to charity. The church is bad, really bad, but it doesn't necessarily follow that they must be entirely bad at everything. You want them to be?
People want the churches gone. yeah. Shouldn't the atheists, the skeptics, the humanists do enough to the replace church charities in all their $ billions?
One last note:
Even secularists tell me the bureaucrats running the secular U.N. and its charities are corrupt. The U.N. is bad, in a lot of ways.
It's more nuanced than that tho. As for these other international secular charities. Have you looked up even one?
Google say, "Problems with Oxfam." They have real problems, like most international agencies have.
But the posters who mention these agencies speak sorta like I should see it as some kinda hopeful, ideal alternative, not see it for what it is, warts and all.
Politics.
Ugh so much text. So much to respond to.
Ah the Vatican. One person tells me they are incredibly rich. The next person tells me they've been sued into bankruptcy, and got no money, yay.
Now the vatican is a small place crammed with old buildings. Whatever that is worth. Did you say they built a castle there? Another country?
I understand the pope has a vacation residence but I hadn't heard he was building castles, and I've heard plenty about them.
I'm sure they have money.
I was a foolish catholic when I was young and saw the priest buy a car with parish money. I do not know how many cars the higher ups buy.
The higher ups hobnob with the rich and powerful so I wouldn't be suprised if they bought some nice cars.
Now I've seen Jewelry used for church services and some official occasions, but I'm not aware of the higher ups having great stores of jewelry.
Everybody says the Vatican has a lot of treasure, however I don't think you can dump so many treasures all in one year.
The luxury market for it would not be able to obsorb so many expensive religious Tokens and paintings, etc. when there's plenty of luxury goods already.
Further, many of their 'treasures' are dusty old doocuments. Limited market for those too. A little down the post I talk about church $ anyways.
Most of the non-document treasures are placed in museums for the public. Yeah they could be sold.
Most of the church is lay people, priests, nuns etc. Proportionally there aren't that many higher ups. That limited number of people are hogging vast sums?
In addition to having their grubby hands on museum pieces? Is the church just paying its common workers ridiculous sums?
Catholic charitiies is the largest religious charity in the world. The church dumps big money into it every year, plus money into it's many other smaller charities.
How much $ in catholic charities? 4.5 billion, world wide. Look it up. Surely they keep that $ too. How does that compare to the $800 million you say the government gives it.
Sure they don't need government $, Is the government $ being kept or thrown in with the rest of the charity money? Where are they keeping all these treasures
they buy every year for going on what a thousand years now? Do they just keep all that the money in the bank? Sitting there every year, accumulating interest.
So they can buy a castle now and then? They must own the banks by now. A conspiracy? They are not saving vast sums they're spending it?
Where's the investigative reporters when we need them, the brave Atheist to expose them. The church is suppressing the free press on top of it? Conspiracy again?
Yeah they got money. how much? Why hasn't yearly compound interest made them richer than you say they are? The, few church hierarchy really spend so much every freaking week
that the bank accounts don't increase. Wow. Yeah they spend money innefficiently. A convention here a vacation there and the great sums of $ are gone?
Is it that the church is so rich or is it they spend their money inefficiently.
Maybe the 150 Billion they spend on hospitals and colleges is a waste. The few church leaders are keeping more than the 150 billion the hospitals and colleges get for themselves? Spending it? Saving it?
All that money hogged by the few church hierarchy, and still billions left for the charity? And the secular organisations? Less than $500 million for Oxfam, for example.
Damn the church is wealthier than god. Perhaps someone wants to say that on top of all that 'vast' money they already have, they keep the charity money?
Have you considered the possibility that they already spend far far more than they could get selling their museum pieces.
Now lets talk about how you say they should put the money into poor countries. As if they never do.
The great, majority of these countries are controlled by dictators, communists. You want the church to pump lots of $ into them.
Do you know how hard it is to dump money into such corrupt countries. Your secular u.s. government does it and we know how that turns out.
How do you think they should deal with it when the dictator comes down on them because the church helped that tribe or race the dictator especially loves to
suppress or genocide? When he starts killing the christians in the country because he doesn't like the church's interference? Oh well let them kill, its about giving $.
There are plenty of other problems that come with operating in corrupt dictatorships, working around communists.
For example working in the middle of one of their many wars. How about the poor muslim majority countries, who will kill them on even a rumor that they preached jesus.
Think the money will help fix it? Would you love to critisize the church for paying off dictators?
Maybe they should send a joke of a force - the vatican guards - with guns to force the charity on the country?
I'm not saying its all hard for the church but when considering issues like this it's best to at least try some perspective.
The christians love to repeat to each other and Us there dumbest arguements. Tho, all their arguments are dumb.
They never think it through or do their research. I feels like I'm getting a dumb Vatican arguement that's repeated again and again by atheists.
Should I just accept it? Like christians do their arguments?
Now about secular programs. I tried food stamps when I was down. Do you know you have to be employed,
or else a unemployed woman with children to get food stamps? I couldn't. You said Medicaid, It doesn't pay everything, which doesn't help if your unemployed.
My mother needed to purchase second insurance with medicaid to just to pay her cancer bills.
and then, taxes. I think the churches should pay taxes. But you haven't even demonstrated say, that they pocket the money. For all I know, the
money they save goes to charity. The church is bad, really bad, but it doesn't necessarily follow that they must be entirely bad at everything. You want them to be?
People want the churches gone. yeah. Shouldn't the atheists, the skeptics, the humanists do enough to the replace church charities in all their $ billions?
One last note:
Even secularists tell me the bureaucrats running the secular U.N. and its charities are corrupt. The U.N. is bad, in a lot of ways.
It's more nuanced than that tho. As for these other international secular charities. Have you looked up even one?
Google say, "Problems with Oxfam." They have real problems, like most international agencies have.
But the posters who mention these agencies speak sorta like I should see it as some kinda hopeful, ideal alternative, not see it for what it is, warts and all.
Politics.
Ugh so much text. So much to respond to.
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