(March 10, 2012 at 3:21 am)chipan Wrote:DeistPaladin Wrote:Did you know that dogs don't exist in nature? They're the result of artificial selection (that is, they were bred from wolves).
Only proves that verity can exist without millions of years.
With artificial selection, ala horse breeding or dog breeding, yes. Artificial selection is much faster than natural selection. So, hypothetically, humans could have possibly been bred from ape-like beings by some artificial process by an alien or higher intelligence in just a few hundred thousand years. Hypothetically!
My point is that evolution is a very real and observed process that both explains and predicts the variety of life on this planet, whether the process is by artificial, natural or combined selection. Evolution is simply the observation that life forms change over time as needed to suit its environment.
The only difference between natural and artificial selection is with the latter involves manipulation of the environment and breeding to produce some planned result. Therefore, a god (or, hypothetically, an alien race) being involved is beside the point. Evolution is both real and observed.
Quote:It is not clearly defined. I can only give examples, such as all dogs are a kind. All horses are a kind and donkeys and possibly zebras.
If "kind" is not clearly defined, we're going to have a hard time discussing it. In science, we use very strictly defined terms so communication is clear. For example, a "species" (the most finely that biologists will categorize life) is defined according to its ability to breed with other life forms. If two life forms can't produce a fertile offspring, they are of different species. For example, a donkey and a horse will produce a mule if mated, but the mule is infertile. Therefore, donkeys and horses are of different species. When a life form evolves to a point where it can no longer mate and produce a fertile offspring with its original life form, it's called "speciation".
It seems to me like "kind" is a crude expression of "species" only without any specific definition of the term so the goal posts can move about.
Quote:You are right if you go by today's evidence. However, I believe our genetics have gotten worse over the generations making imbreading impossible today but not back then. Plus, Noah's sons brought their wives FYI. Genesis 7:13.
Noah's grandchildren would all have the same paternal grandfather, so you'd still end up with a family tree that doesn't sufficiently fork to produce a viable species. The animals would be in even worse shape, since their children wouldn't have any offspring to breed with except each other. You say our genetics have "gotten worse" but I'm not sure how inbreeding would ever produce a sustainable species.
Quote:That verse does not say God created the stars on day 2.
Yes, it does. Stars can't "sing" if they don't exist yet. They clearly existed when Yahweh laid the foundation of the earth, ergo stars came before the earth.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist