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(December 18, 2012 at 2:25 am)clemdog14 Wrote: Hello.
I do not claim to be a scientist. I'm just investigating whether or not Dawkin's views hold up logically.
From which perspective?
Scientifically as the man is a Molecular biologist.
Or are you claiming/ assuming that he is a god and one must look at Richard Dawkins arguments philosophically?
I am looking at some of his arguments philosophically. I am not attacking his scientific expertise.
(December 18, 2012 at 2:25 am)clemdog14 Wrote: Here is one of the problems from God Delusion. Dawkins incorrectly assumes that one should accept unguided Darwinian evolution over the existence of God.
Wonderful!! Have you finished the book?? have you read any of his other works??
How about Hitchens? Harris? Dennett? a bazillion other critics of this abrahamic deity ?
I read most of God Delusion, however, the ad hominems got old really quickly. As for the others, I'm getting there ;D
No. Dawkins does not " incorrectly assumes that one should accept unguided Darwinian evolution over the existence of God."
If I remember the book clearly he raises the question of why have a god at all as evolution is clearly demonstrated down to the molecular level.
I understand, I am not looking at the whole premise of the book, rather, I am investigating a claim that he made which appears to be logically invalid.
Once again this: " incorrectly assumes that one should accept unguided Darwinian evolution over the existence of God." was for the evidence that I posted. Not on the whole thesis of the book.
(December 18, 2012 at 2:25 am)clemdog14 Wrote: The kicker is that even though he states both are exceedingly improbable, he still concedes that we should accept the former based on that its the "best explanation." This does not follow. Why should I pick the former if both are exceedingly improbable? Couldn't one say that one could remain agnostic on choosing between the two?
This is the most sense you have made so far...keep coming
(December 18, 2012 at 2:25 am)clemdog14 Wrote: Here is my source:
In The God Delusion he argues that the existence of God is monumentally improbable—about as probable as the assembly of a flight-worthy Boeing 747 by a hurricane roaring through a junkyard. Now it is not monumentally improbable, he says, that life should have developed by way of unguided Darwinism. In fact the probability that the stunning complexity of life came to be in that fashion is greater than the probability that there is such a person as God. An explanation involving divine design, therefore, is less probable than the explanation in terms of unguided Darwinism; therefore we should prefer unguided Darwinism to an explanation involving design; but these two are the only viable candidates here; therefore by an inference to the best explanation, we should accept unguided Darwinism.
Clearly a host of considerations clamor for attention here. Concede, for the moment, that unguided Darwinism is more probable than an explanation involving design; does it follow that the former is to be preferred to the latter? There is more to goodness in explanation than the probability of the explanans. And how secure is this alleged inference to the best explanation, as an argument form, or, more likely, maxim? If all the explanations are highly unlikely, am I obliged, nonetheless, to pick and endorse one of them? I hear a great roar from the Notre Dame stadium; either the Irish have scored a touchdown, or an extra point, or a field goal, or a safety, or completed a long pass, or made a long run from scrimmage, or tackled the opposing runner for a loss, or intercepted a pass. Suppose these eight explanations exhaust the field, and suppose the first is slightly more probable than any of the other seven; its probability, on the evidence is .2. Am I obliged to believe that explanation, just because it is more probable than the rest, and even though its probability is much below .5? Whatever happened to agnosticism, withholding belief?
Plantinga, Alvin (2011-10-26). Where the Conflict Really Lies: Science, Religion, and Naturalism (pp. 28-29). Oxford University Press. Kindle Edition.
Thank you.
Yes, I am a Christian on these forums. I am not here to judge or condemn, rather, I am here to debate, learn, and incite discussion. Yes, I think that my avatar is hilarious.