(May 17, 2013 at 7:57 pm)Tiberius Wrote:Nice to see a fellow Brit Ok, fine. You're a libertarian, I get that, but you have to understand Tiberius, that what is right and what is fair is always subjective when the government legislates, we have that imposed upon us through popular appeal, special interest groups and righteous benevolent politicians who believe that their opinions should be taken as Bible by the rest of the population. From the taxation system, to foreign policy, to drugs policy, to NHS policy, to the justice system. There is no such thing as an objective "fair" in a secular democracy, the utopia of "fairness" or "rightness" by which I assume you mean 'what Tiberius considers fair or right', doesn't exist.(May 17, 2013 at 7:47 pm)ideologue08 Wrote: The people of the UK don't want mother-son marriages TiberiusI'm from the UK. I'm well aware this isn't what the people want. However, sometimes, it isn't about what people want, it's about what is right. Whilst many people may disagree with lots of different types of relationship, there are no good reasons to ban relationships (or marriages) between two consenting adults who are in love. None. Nada. All the excuses people come up with are based on their own discriminatory views and tastes, often bundled with religious views.
I'm a Libertarian. I don't want government to enact laws according to popular opinion or what I personally believe. I want government to enact laws based on what is right and what is fair, despite what the popular opinion is and despite what I believe. I find the idea of mother-son marriages to be repulsive, but you know what? I don't have the right to say they can't marry just because they fell in love with the "wrong" type of person.
Quote:so why should we fall for the reason that gays are giving us, two loving consenting adults?There's nothing to fall for. It's a perfectly valid reason. Why should marriage (and all the lovely legal benefits you get with it) be discriminatory, as it currently is? The whole point of freedom is that everyone is treated as equals. Marriage currently doesn't do that.
Quote:I seriously never heard so much BS in my life. No wonder the petition against gay marriage has 10 times more signatories than the petition for gay marriage.You're very close to committing the argumentum ad populum fallacy. The majority is not always right. In this case, they are very very wrong.
What you consider to be fair or right isn't what I consider to be fair or right. It is not necessarily fair for wealthier higher income earners to pay a higher marginal income tax rate, yet I still consider it to be right. A mother and her son marrying is not "right" according to what I perceive to be "right" and so yes, the definition of marriage is indeed unfair, and it should remain so in my opinion. I do commend your consistency though
But everyone will never be treated as equals in a society Tiberius; a 13 year old cannot get into an 18 year rated movie unsupervised. A person who earns 150 K a year is not treated equally to a person who earns 20K in terms of taxes. Equality does not exist in most spheres of society, there should be no such thing as equality in the definition of marriage in my opinion.
I wasn't trying to use argumentum ad populum, just added it for a bit of fun