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beginning of The Universe theories
#66
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RE: beginning of The Universe theories
(August 11, 2013 at 2:55 am)whateverist Wrote:
(August 10, 2013 at 11:11 pm)ManMachine Wrote:



That went completely over my head. Nonetheless, I remain convinced that observations obtained within the singularity event of which we are a part cannot possibly yield evidence for everything from nothing and once only. Mathematical models are just that and they may very well describe what we observe without shedding one bit of light on the question of prior conditions. Sorry, I just find it absurd on the face of it. If you're asking me to accept it on the theorizing of experts, I would still need to understand at least in some approximate way how what we are able to observe within this singularity event reflects upon the larger picture. To assume there is no larger picture just because that isn't contained within this singularity event strikes me as obtuse. If I may ask, what expertise do you have to speak on this?

Don't get me wrong, I think you're right to be sceptical, and you should not be convinced by me or any other person but by weight of reason, and there, as Shakespeare wrote, is the rub.

When it was published Einstein's Special Theory of Relativity was based on Mathematical Models, and a lot of people at the time were sceptical of his work. In fact others and Einstein himself refined the Mathematical Models after the original presentation of special relativity in 1905. Pretty much all of Quantum Theory is built on Mathematical Models and much of the evidence we now have only came along a considerable time after the theory.

Quantum Theory suggest that there are many more dimensions that the four we can comprehend in a physical sense, do we disregard all quantum theory because we cannot grasp the concepts? Einstein was so displeased with Quantum Theory he uttered those now infamous words 'God does not play with dice', and he remained displeased until his death. So you are in good company.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'singularity event', but I have given a more detailed description of how something from nothing works in another thread (below).

Something from Nothing, in a little bit more detail;



You don't have to accept anything, it's up to you to decide what level and type of proof you find reasonable and satisfactory and I can understand you wanting to remain within a framework you feel comfortable with.

Just remember, to make an omelette you need to break a few eggs.

MM

(August 11, 2013 at 6:55 am)downbeatplumb Wrote:
(August 11, 2013 at 12:23 am)Minimalist Wrote: No one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle.

Even and I want to make this clear..even if they do say Jehovah.


The life of brian surely the finest movie ever made.

Look, I'd had a lovely supper and all I said to my wife was that piece of Halibut was good enough for Jehovah.

MM
"The greatest deception men suffer is from their own opinions" - Leonardo da Vinci

"I think I use the term “radical” rather loosely, just for emphasis. If you describe yourself as “atheist,” some people will say, “Don’t you mean ‘agnostic’?” I have to reply that I really do mean atheist, I really do not believe that there is a god; in fact, I am convinced that there is not a god (a subtle difference). I see not a shred of evidence to suggest that there is one ... etc., etc. It’s easier to say that I am a radical atheist, just to signal that I really mean it, have thought about it a great deal, and that it’s an opinion I hold seriously." - Douglas Adams (and I echo the sentiment)
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Messages In This Thread
beginning of The Universe theories - by John79 - August 1, 2013 at 3:50 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Faith No More - August 1, 2013 at 4:09 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Anomalocaris - August 1, 2013 at 4:16 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Nine - August 1, 2013 at 4:46 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Kayenneh - August 1, 2013 at 5:02 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by orogenicman - August 1, 2013 at 5:12 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by gall - August 20, 2013 at 11:11 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by One Above All - August 1, 2013 at 5:19 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by pocaracas - August 1, 2013 at 5:48 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Kayenneh - August 1, 2013 at 5:51 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Tonus - August 1, 2013 at 5:59 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Napoléon - August 1, 2013 at 6:13 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Jackalope - August 1, 2013 at 6:26 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Nine - August 1, 2013 at 7:41 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 1, 2013 at 7:49 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Minimalist - August 1, 2013 at 8:03 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by popeyespappy - August 1, 2013 at 8:10 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 1, 2013 at 9:24 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by popeyespappy - August 1, 2013 at 9:30 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Whateverist - August 1, 2013 at 8:36 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Whateverist - August 2, 2013 at 12:18 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 1, 2013 at 9:28 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 1, 2013 at 9:35 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by popeyespappy - August 1, 2013 at 9:42 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 1, 2013 at 9:50 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by popeyespappy - August 1, 2013 at 10:09 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 1, 2013 at 10:29 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by popeyespappy - August 1, 2013 at 10:49 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 1, 2013 at 10:53 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by popeyespappy - August 1, 2013 at 11:00 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Minimalist - August 1, 2013 at 11:13 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by orogenicman - August 2, 2013 at 7:04 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Minimalist - August 2, 2013 at 5:20 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Anomalocaris - August 2, 2013 at 5:25 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by pocaracas - August 2, 2013 at 6:03 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by ManMachine - August 7, 2013 at 7:58 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Terr - August 7, 2013 at 8:38 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by ManMachine - August 7, 2013 at 9:01 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Terr - August 7, 2013 at 9:36 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Whateverist - August 10, 2013 at 1:08 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by ManMachine - August 10, 2013 at 11:11 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Whateverist - August 11, 2013 at 2:55 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by ManMachine - August 11, 2013 at 7:20 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Tonus - August 11, 2013 at 8:04 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Terr - August 11, 2013 at 8:10 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by popeyespappy - August 7, 2013 at 9:44 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by ManMachine - August 8, 2013 at 6:51 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by popeyespappy - August 8, 2013 at 7:40 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by supergenius - August 7, 2013 at 10:10 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by NoraBrimstone - August 9, 2013 at 9:44 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 9, 2013 at 12:17 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by NoraBrimstone - August 9, 2013 at 12:42 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Kayenneh - August 9, 2013 at 10:03 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Kayenneh - August 9, 2013 at 12:19 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Cyberman - August 9, 2013 at 12:34 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Cyberman - August 9, 2013 at 12:37 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 9, 2013 at 1:19 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by NoraBrimstone - August 9, 2013 at 3:52 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 9, 2013 at 4:23 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by NoraBrimstone - August 9, 2013 at 4:45 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Minimalist - August 11, 2013 at 12:23 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by downbeatplumb - August 11, 2013 at 6:55 am
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by fr0d0 - August 9, 2013 at 4:50 pm
RE: beginning of The Universe theories - by Terr - August 9, 2013 at 9:54 pm

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