The Holodomor: Starvation of more than 6 million Ukrainians by Stalin

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Bullshit. English people generally have a positive view of the Irish but if you happen to be an English child in an Irish school you are guaranteed to be bullied and called a 'tan'. The emnity is a one way street .

Sorry, it isn't bullshit at all. I grew up and went to uni in Northern Ireland. In England, an Irish accent is enough to get you lousy service, or no service at all. When I bought my first home in Belfast, I had to go through a 'front', since the English owners had instructed the estate agent not to sell to taigs. I'm not a taig, but I have a typically Irish surname, and that was enough.

The Government of the UK ,which included Ireland did very little.

Really? Keeping the price of foodstuffs artificially high, refusing requests from O'Donnell and others to reign in the high rents and interest rates that were crushing the Irish, denying starving people wrack rights - all of these and other sanctioned policies not only did nothing to help with the hunger, they actually made it worse. Much worse.

in 1780 Britain was a different country to Ireland, post 1803 it was the same country but then you know that but want to continue trying to pretend otherwise

The Act of Union aside, Ireland and England have ALWAYS been different. Socially, linguistically and culturally, they are not the same place, despite whatever political fictions you subscribe to. If England had truly viewed Ireland as a part of the United Kingdom, they would have done a helluva lot more to keep a million people from starving to death.

The penal laws applied accross the whole country -not just Ireland

Yes, they were, and I never said or implied otherwise. But their effect was MUCH greater in Ireland, due to the larger percentage of Catholics in the general population.

As I said it was one country in the mid nineteenth century.

And today, Northern Ireland is part and parcel of the United Kingdom, so clearly, they are the same country and the same sets of laws apply equally to both Ireland and England [NB: The preceding is known as 'sarcasm']

The UK had no legal right to prevent the movement of goods within the UK.

In your own word, 'Bullshit'. The UK could and can halt the movement of ANY goods at any time. Look it up.

And the notion that England only had a legal say in what went on in Ireland from the Act of Union forward is, to say the least, farcical.

But hey lets not destroy the myth about 'Da Bruddish'. Lets pretend that the Landlords weren't Irish

Of COURSE the landlords were Irish - who is saying otherwise? But the Plantation system and absenteeism doesn't excuse the callous indifference of the British government when they could have done something, but chose not to.

and pretend the whole affair was deliberately engineered by 'Da Bruddish' as a genocide

I'm not claiming that. In fact, I said exactly the opposite. Furthermore, I'm not claiming that the Brits are brutes (although I have personal reasons for the claim, if I chose to make it) - in fact, I praised them for their reaction to an earlier famine.

(and forget of course ireland's appalling stance in World war II because national myth is always more important than real knowledge.

I'm not sure how neutrality is 'appalling', but OK. I do think Dev's condolences on the death of Hitler were, to say the least, ill-advised.

Queen victoria donated 10,000 pounds personally,

Check your facts. It was £2000.

the Chruch of England organised massive collections (the vatican sent nothing...of course but they prayed)

I agree with all of the above. Relief from the COE was helpful, the Vatican's response was dismal at best. The only way it could have been worse would have been if, instead of doing nothing, they had actually facilitated the starvation.

I suppose you reject the new history movement that is spreading in History departments in ireland that has grown up a lot in the past two decades and lo longer sees national myth as a sensible way of approaching history.

Nothing of the sort. I prefer facts to myth (I was educated as an historian, actually). But we're about even here - I'm rejecting myths and you're rejecting facts.

Oh and the source you need is found in the book Debunking history: 151 popular myths exploded Rayner, E. G. Stapley, R. F.
Stroud : Sutton 2002

Thank you. I'll look into it.

Boru