Q: do you, Christian, claim that God exists, rather than you believe that he ...
February 23, 2014 at 11:10 pm
(This post was last modified: February 24, 2014 at 12:44 am by Rampant.A.I..)
(February 23, 2014 at 7:24 pm)fr0d0 Wrote:(February 23, 2014 at 1:41 pm)rasetsu Wrote: We've been down this road many times. So far no theist has made a convincing demonstration that the mere existence of the universe is evidence for anything but its mere existence.
Given God the creator, creation is all the evidence we need of his intervention. Nothing further needs to be said or done. That statement is complete.
The "givens" you're asking for here:
<The universe was created by a conscious entity>
<That entity is my Religion's God>
<God exists>
<That God is my Religion's God>
<The universe is intelligently designed>
<God created the universe>
<God created everything in the universe>
(February 23, 2014 at 7:24 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Further proof of anything about anything is redundant conjecture.
It would be, if you were speaking to contemporaries who assumed all of the conclusions listed above were "given", for the sake of argument building on those conclusions as premises.
However, you've been asked to provide arguments to support the above conclusions before you can introduce them as premises and show the conclusion <My God is the creator> you introduced as self-supporting.
That conclusion is only self-evident to people who believe it to be: And belief is not logical support.
