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Free will/evil/punishment
#56
RE: Free will/evil/punishment
(June 16, 2015 at 10:55 am)bennyboy Wrote:
(June 16, 2015 at 12:20 am)wallym Wrote: So, I'd say rather than free will, we're just dealing with a lack of knowledge which looks a lot like what many call free will.  

It sounds goofy, but I wonder if part of the fabric of reality includes this fact-- that there are barriers to knowledge which make things like mind and will unfathomable.  For sure, if you see the brain as supervenient on the brain, modeling all the QM particles in the brain is going to present a computational barrier that we will probably never overcome.

I claim agnosticism, but I'm actually an ambiguist-- I think that especially at boundary conditions, polar opposites conflate into a single paradox, and perspective supercedes "reality."  So in this case, I think at the boundary of our investigations of the mechanics of the brain, QM craziness will actually give way to a seemingly non-determinist mind and will that cannot be differentiated from a deeply free will, but that if you investigate mind and will, they will give way to a classical determinism.  Impossible for both to hold true, but it's also impossible for a wave to be a particle.    /LSD flashback speculation

I don't know what enough of those words mean to reply to most of it.

I will say that I don't think determinism is necessary for an absence of free will.  If QM truly is random/unpredictable, our future is undetermined.  But that wouldn't change the fact that "We" aren't a part of what makes it.
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Messages In This Thread
Free will/evil/punishment - by ILuvGorillas - June 14, 2015 at 12:20 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 12:29 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Exian - June 14, 2015 at 12:37 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 1:37 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 8:27 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 9:25 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 15, 2015 at 12:35 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 12:52 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 15, 2015 at 1:05 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by JuliaL - June 14, 2015 at 12:44 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 14, 2015 at 12:50 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 1:39 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by abaris - June 15, 2015 at 9:32 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by robvalue - June 14, 2015 at 2:40 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 4:32 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by robvalue - June 14, 2015 at 4:37 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 8:10 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by robvalue - June 14, 2015 at 8:27 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by henryp - June 14, 2015 at 10:34 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 7:51 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 14, 2015 at 8:21 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 9:19 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 14, 2015 at 11:06 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 14, 2015 at 11:23 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 11:59 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 15, 2015 at 12:23 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 8:30 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 14, 2015 at 8:48 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 14, 2015 at 9:08 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 9:22 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 14, 2015 at 10:00 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 11:10 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 15, 2015 at 8:20 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 9:35 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 15, 2015 at 12:47 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 4:11 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Thumpalumpacus - June 15, 2015 at 12:19 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 14, 2015 at 11:27 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Aroura - June 15, 2015 at 12:49 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by robvalue - June 15, 2015 at 5:00 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by henryp - June 15, 2015 at 10:55 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 15, 2015 at 7:44 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by robvalue - June 15, 2015 at 9:00 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 15, 2015 at 10:31 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 15, 2015 at 12:54 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by robvalue - June 15, 2015 at 12:00 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by henryp - June 15, 2015 at 9:43 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 15, 2015 at 2:39 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 15, 2015 at 3:36 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 15, 2015 at 3:57 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 19, 2015 at 5:20 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 10:11 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by henryp - June 16, 2015 at 12:20 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 10:55 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by henryp - June 16, 2015 at 12:46 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 15, 2015 at 10:38 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 16, 2015 at 11:26 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 6:19 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 16, 2015 at 7:02 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 7:39 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2015 at 5:41 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 19, 2015 at 6:16 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2015 at 6:39 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2015 at 7:00 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 19, 2015 at 9:36 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by bennyboy - June 19, 2015 at 7:03 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by Mudhammam - June 19, 2015 at 9:46 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by henryp - June 21, 2015 at 10:35 am
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2015 at 10:20 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by popsthebuilder - June 21, 2015 at 6:03 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by The Grand Nudger - June 21, 2015 at 6:04 pm
RE: Free will/evil/punishment - by popsthebuilder - June 21, 2015 at 6:15 pm

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