Are you for or against the separation of church and state?

[Godscreated]

What is observable should speak for itself, the more God is displaced in this country the worse things have gotten. When I was growing up we didn't lock our doors at night and when my parents sent me and my sister to school, they never considered we would be harmed. I could go on and on, but I believe everyone understands what I'm saying.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_th..._over_time

Doesn't mention God anywhere.

You expected a secular publication to mention God, are you that naive. look these up and read what was said and not said during these trials.
Engel v Vitale yr. 1962
Murray (O'Hair) v Curlett yr. 1963
Abington Township School District v Schempp yr. 1963

After you have finished reading them (that's if you're even serious) go look on the site you posted and see when the crime rate took a jump, that's right 1964, maybe then you'll see the lie wiki is promoting.

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You need to look into the recent history of this country. When I was going to school we had daily prayer, the Bible was read to students in class, the Ten Commandments hung on the wall, children were learning the value of others. By the time I was in high school most of this had been removed from schools and it was telling, not so much with my age group, but the ones coming in behind us. Now kids are killing kids and teachers and principals. When a girl got pregnant she left school to have the baby, why, because it was an embarrassment to her and her family. Now nurseries are set up in school. I do not expect you to understand, we come from very different times, but to be honest seeing what was and what is, I really believe what was, was much better. I do not believe the government should be controlled by the church, that's exactly what the founders wanted to make sure of, and that never happened, even before God was removed.

Bud, take off your nostalgia glasses and actually look at the world; for example, I don't know about where you are, but where I am, those girls who got pregnant and left school to have their baby sometimes had those kids forcibly adopted without their consent. And I'm being very charitable and avoiding the misogynistic "embarrassment to her family" line, which is objectively just crap spackle.

Every generation is absolutely sure that things were better in theirs, but even if we were to take your claim as true, it only goes back a certain length of time; once we get back to the point of theocratic violence- otherwise known as maximum god- things start to get worse.

Boston, today you idiot.

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When a girl got pregnant she left school to have the baby, why, because it was an embarrassment to her and her family. Now nurseries are set up in school. I do not expect you to understand, we come from very different times, but to be honest seeing what was and what is, I really believe what was, was much better. I do not believe the government should be controlled by the church, that's exactly what the founders wanted to make sure of, and that never happened, even before God was removed.

Well… There's this:
http://www.thenationalcampaign.org/resou...0-2006.pdf
See that lovely spike of teenage pregnancy from about 1948 until around 1961? Yeah… teen pregnancy rates have fallen since then, in fact they are currently lower than at any other point on the chart. I understand that it was a "simpler time" and teens were forced to marry if they got pregnant, people tended to get married earlier, etc. But still, the rate is lower than it was back in the "good old days." Thank you, birth control.

The mass murder of unborn children are the only reason, if the abortions were added to today's teen pregnancy rate you would definitely have a higher rate. You should be ashamed of trying to deceive others, all things need to be taken into account. Killing children is part of the problem not a solution.

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I sometimes think people from an older generation don't realize how much more we communicate and have access to the happenings in the country, making it seem like things happen MORE even if they actually happen LESS, simply because we can actually see it and it doesn't get hushed up.

I believe that people today just want to bury their heads in the sand or take what they believe is the easy way out. They say hey it's not happening to me, I couldn't care less, is today's attitude. There is more revealed today and that can be a good thing, most today do not even care.

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You need to look into the recent history of this country. When I was going to school we had daily prayer, the Bible was read to students in class, the Ten Commandments hung on the wall, children were learning the value of others. By the time I was in high school most of this had been removed from schools and it was telling, not so much with my age group, but the ones coming in behind us. Now kids are killing kids and teachers and principals. When a girl got pregnant she left school to have the baby, why, because it was an embarrassment to her and her family. Now nurseries are set up in school. I do not expect you to understand, we come from very different times, but to be honest seeing what was and what is, I really believe what was, was much better. I do not believe the government should be controlled by the church, that's exactly what the founders wanted to make sure of, and that never happened, even before God was removed.

Yeah, back in the day, life was pretty sweet if you were white, Christian, straight, and working class. It's too bad that your anecdotal idea of the world in which you grew up is artificial.

When you were going to school, while you had children indoctrinated in your evil superstitions, you also had women, blacks, and gays excluded from much of society, when Christian-inspired racism, sexism, and homophobia ran rampant. But hey, good for you, whitey.

Love it guy no other argument than the Christians did it, why don't you come back to reality.

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What is observable should speak for itself, the more God is displaced in this country the worse things have gotten. When I was growing up we didn't lock our doors at night and when my parents sent me and my sister to school, they never considered we would be harmed. I could go on and on, but I believe everyone understands what I'm saying.

Religion has never served to protect people or improve living conditions. In fact, the opposite is true. Religion threatens human life and worsens living conditions.

Really, you must have failed U.S. History.

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I went to a public school and students in general were treated fair, I did not describe anything like you did, for all I know you're making that stuff up, what I said is recorded in history.

No they weren't... unless all the students in your school happened to be Christian, or they had prayers for all religions represented in your school. Either way, prayer in school goes against separation of church and state, so your point is moot because separation is a right we have as Americans.

Also, I couldn't care less if you believe me or not, but do you doubt that when I was in elementary school twenty some-odd years ago, the things I described happened?

No I do not doubt those things happened, that was common place in Catholic Schools when I was growing up, that proves nothing. I believe I and the people who went to school back when are the living authorities about that time, you do not get to write our history, we made it, it belongs to us and we've written it with our lives.

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I was bored and did some Googling. Most crime stats you find look from 1950 to the present, and definitely around the 50's crime was at a low. But check this out:
sited from: http://blogs.berkeley.edu/2010/06/16/a-c...n-america/
Violent crime is just a wee bit higher now than it was during the period beginning about 1940 until 1965 or so. Pre-WWII violent crime was about as prevalent as it was in the 80's and 90's and is now once again trending downwards.
Statistics on teen pregnancy and violent crime are recorded history, not your perceptions of some idyllic bygone era, GC.

Your little graph does not look like the one the summerqueen brought up.

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Heh, and the spike of crime in the '20s is directly the fault of Christian Temperance movements, so it's hard to argue that deeper religious influence has a net positive effect on morality.

You are seriously one sick person, the Christians did not commit the crimes, the law was the law and those who did not like it broke it. My father lived during those years, I have first hand knowledge of the times. Because he saw what happened during the twenties, he made a statement to me before he died. He said soon there will be an event similar to the great depression, I asked him how he could know that, his answer, nothings changed man's doing the same thing now that lead to the disaster of '29.' His take, money corrupts and can corrupt completely.