RE: How long will Christians wait for Jesus?
February 24, 2017 at 2:08 pm
(This post was last modified: February 24, 2017 at 2:19 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(February 24, 2017 at 2:03 pm)SteveII Wrote: Doesn't intrinsic value/meaning/purpose have to be endowed by an intentional act of the will?No, then it wouldn't be intrinsic...by your own definition, or by any definition. It wouldn't belong naturally, or be essential..it would be endowed, gifted, granted, assigned.
Quote:With a naturalistic worldview, our value/meaning/purpose does come from what we can do, but since what we could do has shifted quite a bit in our evolutionary history, it is self-assessed. Anything that is self-assessed cannot be intrinsic can it?Creatures that don;t self assess can still do things. The one does not seem to have anything to do with the other.
Quote:I believe our value/meaning/purpose comes with being intentionally made in the image of God.That's nice, but suppose we weren;t intentionally made in the image of your god, and just so happened to be in the image of your god. Would we be worth less?
Quote:When I say "...naturally, essential", I mean always had, built-in, not separable.Then you have a problem with words...and you have a problem with your own statements. Is it vaulable because it was built in, or because it is in? Because we were given x, or because we have x? What would the relative values of something who was givn x and something who has x be?
Quote:I will adjust my phrasing in the future.-but you'll never adjust your position. Convenient, lol.
Quote:I took it already to be a block of wood in my example, but if you were to back up a step, it would have the properties of being part of a tree. It lost the property of tree-ness when it was cut up. I don't think it every had a "purpose" (a reason for being) unless it was designed.And a block of wood, itself, serves many purposes. There's really no direction to go with this one Steve, it was just silly. Stop saying purpose and say design. Stop saying value and say endowment. Say what you mean, mean what you say.
You don;t actually think that naturalism leaves us with no purpose. You think it leaves us with no design...which is just as untrue as the previous version (unless you want to make another revision..and say that it leaves us with no "divine designs"). You don;t think that naturalism leaves us with no intrinsic value, you think it leaves us with no endowment...which, again, is just as untrue in this revision as it was in the original wording (unless you want to make further revision to "divine endowment").
Does the veracity of or a commitment to naturalism rule out your silly god? OFC it does. Does it rule out all the things you've attached to your silly god and obfuscated over? Nope.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!