Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: April 28, 2024, 12:52 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Would Jesus promote punishing the innocent instead of the guilty?
RE: Would Jesus promote punishing the innocent instead of the guilty?
Vicky Q Wrote:Yes. The genealogy is intended amongst other things to emphasise that Jesus follows the OT story.

Let's just say that Matthew and Luke gave two different genealogies which are not evidence of anything. They maybe want to correspond to Jesus story with OT, but then again they likely reflect the political allegiances of the authors.

Vicky Q Wrote:The promise to Abraham was never meant to be just to one nation about just a patch of the Middle East. It was to humanity, about the world. The suffering servant of Isaiah, something of an interpretive mystery, turned out to be Jesus representing Israel. God's promise to return to Jerusalem, enacted in the 'Palm Sunday' events, suddenly became clear.

That's called wishful thinking.

Vicky Q Wrote:Paul refers directly and indirectly to the OT story throughout his letters. For example, in Romans 9 he is analysing the ongoing Jew/Gentile divide by looking at both the wider story and specific OT passages. He is treating the OT much like the early acts of a play, to which the later acts must be faithful.

What Paul is doing is trying to tie mystical religions and many of the practices, such as baptism and sacred meals (probably even the mysteries of Mithras where he "introduces an image of a resurrection") with Judaism which were already in use among the mystery religions in the Greco-Roman world to draw non Jews to temples, and not Jesus from the Gospels. Like in Romans 11 I want you to understand this mystery: a hardening has come upon part of Israel, until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved; as it is written: 'Out of Zion will come the Deliverer; he will banish ungodliness from Jacob.' 'And this is my covenant with them, when I take away their sins.'

Paul seems to be talking about the coming of a future "Deliverer", but he makes no mention at all of Jesus here. If Jesus had just been here then why is Paul talking about old scriptures instead of Jesus Christ, who had just been here?

Furthermore, in Philippians 3, 20 Paul says that they are expecting a Savior from heaven, which is Jesus. He doesn't say that they are expecting him to come back again or anything like that, but that they are expecting a Savior from heaven for the first time. "But our commonwealth is in heaven, and it is from there that we are expecting a Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ."

Indeed, Paul's main preoccupation in his epistles was that it was not necessary to follow the "Law" of Judaism, particularly circumcision and dietary observation, but that a "new covenant" had been established, which was based on "faith". He declares that the "promise" made by God to Abraham existed before the "law." ("If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's offspring and heirs according to the promise.") But, honestly, who really cares? Jesus never said anything about any of this stuff, but Paul never concerns himself with Jesus' teachings; his goal is to get Gentiles into the church, and the only way that he can justify such radical action is with his faith trumps-law argument.

Vicky Q Wrote:Please read the whole of Jeremiah 31, because Matthew is using this verse as a kind of tag for the whole thing.

You read it and you'll see there is no mention of Jesus there, nor Herod's slaughter of the innocents -- it's all in the heads of Christian readers who are using the technique of "wishful thinking".
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
Reply



Messages In This Thread
RE: Would Jesus promote punishing the innocent instead of the guilty? - by Fake Messiah - August 19, 2020 at 4:52 am

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Archbishop Philip Wilson guilty of concealing child sex abuses zebo-the-fat 3 815 May 23, 2018 at 12:13 am
Last Post: Wyrd of Gawd
  Jesus Would Be Proud of You, Douchebag Minimalist 37 9219 August 21, 2017 at 2:03 pm
Last Post: downbeatplumb
  Hi, I would like to tell you about Jesus Christ, the only way to God JacquelineDeane55 78 21025 June 10, 2017 at 9:46 am
Last Post: Fireball
  Praise GOD !!!! A Jesus your Vorlon would worship !!!!!! vorlon13 7 1341 April 22, 2017 at 2:02 pm
Last Post: vorlon13
  If they found Jesus' turd what would they do with it? Fake Messiah 64 7080 August 26, 2016 at 4:40 pm
Last Post: Losty
  Christians, would you have saved Jesus, if you had he chance? Simon Moon 294 34442 July 2, 2016 at 11:23 am
Last Post: vorlon13
  Christians - What would you do if it were discovered Jesus never existed? Cecelia 165 33735 September 12, 2015 at 1:20 pm
Last Post: rexbeccarox
  In Christianity, Does Jesus' Soul Have Anything To Do With Why Jesus Is God? JesusIsGod7 18 7244 October 7, 2014 at 12:58 pm
Last Post: JesusHChrist
  Jesus Would Role Over In His Grave Cinjin 7 2344 April 19, 2014 at 3:58 pm
Last Post: Confused Ape
  What if Jesus came back, but discounted much of the bible as heretical, would you still follow him? Brakeman 9 2933 February 6, 2013 at 4:10 pm
Last Post: Ryantology



Users browsing this thread: 2 Guest(s)