RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
December 15, 2020 at 10:01 am
(This post was last modified: December 15, 2020 at 10:18 am by The Grand Nudger.)
@Eleven
Well, that's a cognitive proposition too. If you think it could be provably true, then you've opened the door to it being provably false.
That's what I'm referring to - not whether a proposition is true or false, but... whether, once committed to that by making a cognitive assertion, a person sticks with it rather than asserting cognitivism when it helps, and abandoning the same when it hurts.
A soul forge may exist and offer an explanation for why things happen in this life.
A soul forge may exist and -not- offer an explanation for why things happen in this life.
A soul forge may exist and offer an explanation for things in life...that is bad - and that is not our justification.
A soul forge may exist and offer an explanation for things in life...that is good - that's our justification.
All four of these cognitive propositions begin with a soul forges existence, but only one of them can satisfy the proposition that a soul forge is a justification for eternal torment (or, if we prefer, pain and suffering and death and whatnot) regardless of whether a god exists.
What I'm suggesting is that if we float idea four as a cognitive proposition, and we're wrong about that proposition, then our beliefs are provably false and we certainly don't have to wait until we die to figure that out. We may get more clarity after we die, somehow, who knows how (also a cognitive assertion)...but so what? That's not required if statement four is a cognitive statement. It's true or false in this life, and the soul forge, if it exists, is good or bad in this life...and isn't that what we're hoping to explain..this life, with the assertion of the soul forge to begin with?
To me, it seems like a straightforward proposition..and I actually don't need soul forges or gods to explore it. Would you expect to become a better person or learn something from my beating the living shit out of you? Would my starving you or killing your child improve you? How about your child?
Well, that's a cognitive proposition too. If you think it could be provably true, then you've opened the door to it being provably false.
That's what I'm referring to - not whether a proposition is true or false, but... whether, once committed to that by making a cognitive assertion, a person sticks with it rather than asserting cognitivism when it helps, and abandoning the same when it hurts.
(December 15, 2020 at 9:54 am)Confused-by-christianity Wrote: Are we basically starting with:
The soul forge may offer an explanation as to justifying some things that happen in this life.
But, it may not. (It's either true or false).
Are we saying the problem is basically - getting to the truth. (We still don't know if God exists, if He is running the forge, and if it's for a good reason)
A soul forge may exist and offer an explanation for why things happen in this life.
A soul forge may exist and -not- offer an explanation for why things happen in this life.
A soul forge may exist and offer an explanation for things in life...that is bad - and that is not our justification.
A soul forge may exist and offer an explanation for things in life...that is good - that's our justification.
All four of these cognitive propositions begin with a soul forges existence, but only one of them can satisfy the proposition that a soul forge is a justification for eternal torment (or, if we prefer, pain and suffering and death and whatnot) regardless of whether a god exists.
What I'm suggesting is that if we float idea four as a cognitive proposition, and we're wrong about that proposition, then our beliefs are provably false and we certainly don't have to wait until we die to figure that out. We may get more clarity after we die, somehow, who knows how (also a cognitive assertion)...but so what? That's not required if statement four is a cognitive statement. It's true or false in this life, and the soul forge, if it exists, is good or bad in this life...and isn't that what we're hoping to explain..this life, with the assertion of the soul forge to begin with?
To me, it seems like a straightforward proposition..and I actually don't need soul forges or gods to explore it. Would you expect to become a better person or learn something from my beating the living shit out of you? Would my starving you or killing your child improve you? How about your child?
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