Ten Reasons I'm Not a Christian

[Edwardo Piet]

I only need one reason to disbelieve in Christianity: There's no evidence to support it.

[Thor]

I have known for a long time that god said to put homosexuals to death.

Incorrect. The men who wrote the Bible claim that "God" said this.

Big difference.

Those books were books of law for the people pre-jesus era. Those laws were necessary to forge the path of humanity.

Really? Please explain how putting people to death for working on the sabbath "forged the path of humanity".

He paid the price of homosexuality; therefore the death penalty for homosexuality no longer applies.

Please show me anywhere in the Bible where it says Old Testament laws no longer apply. And if they no longer apply, why are they still in the book?

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

Please show me anywhere in the Bible where it says Old Testament laws no longer apply.

Iit doesn't. Jesus is recorded as admonishing his followers to keep the Law [of Moses]

Matthew 5:17-20
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Typically,Christian apologists use a different self-serving interpretation.


If you want to see some REAL facepalm stuff,have look at the actual Jewish prophecy about the Messiah,and compare it with the Christian version.

And if they no longer apply, why are they still in the book?

There are 613 commandment, not 10, but they do not appear in the New Testament..

[Thor]

Please show me anywhere in the Bible where it says Old Testament laws no longer apply.

It doesn't

That's what I thought. Yet I constantly hear Christians talking about how "Mosaic Law" no longer applies. Seems to me they simply want to rationalize away half of their own book because even they realize how idiotic and barbaric it is.

. Jesus is recorded as admonishing his followers to keep the Law [of Moses]

Matthew 5:17-20
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Great stuff. This doesn't jive at all with their contention that Old Testament laws no longer apply. I'll have to keep this verse handy.

[tackattack]

Most traditional jews have a hard time with Messiah as a teacher (as in the psalms of solomon). There are a large group of messianic jews that do believe Jesus was the messiah. Jesus was a Jew and did keep the laws. Like the example with healing people on the Sabbath, he taught a common sense new approach to the laws. Fundie's will also claim that he isn't the fufillment of the law and the laws have no conequence if one follows Jesus principles.

[Abracadabra]

I have two really good reasons to reject Christianity.

1. The God portrayed in the Old Testament is far too ignorant and stupid to be a supposedly all-wise all-benevolent being.

So that story can't be true. That actually eliminated the need to speak to my second reason but I'll speak to it anyway.

2. Any supposed "God" who would have his son nailed to a pole as an example of "love" for humans would even be far sicker than the God of the Old Testament.

So it only gets worse when it becomes "Christianity"

Do I believe in "Jesus"?

Sure. I believe that some guy called the pharisees hypocrites (just as the New Testament claims), and that he renounced the ignorant immoral teachings of the Old Testament (just as the New Testament claims), and that he was crucified for voicing these opinions (just as the New Testament claims).

Other than that, he was probably a Jewish pantheist trying to teach the far better moral values of Mahayana Buddhism. Much of the moral parables and teachings that are associated with him date back to early teachings of Buddhism. The man called "Jesus" had absolutely nothing new to offer in terms of moral teachings, or anything else. He might have been a "nice guy" but that's about it. And he most certainly couldn't have been the "sacrificial lamb of God" sent to be nailed to a pole to pay for the sins of mankind. That very idea is dumber than dirt.

You'd have to believe that our creator is cruder and stupider than moron to believe that.

That's my honest opinion.

Sorry if anyone is offended by that. But seriously, to ask me to believe in that nonsense is basically asking me to believe that a supposedly "all-wise" God is actually dumber than rocks, and ten times more ignorant than a barroom drunkard.

It's a stupid religion. Period amen.

If there exists a spiritual essence to life, let's all hope and "pray" that whoever, or whatever, is responsible for it is nowhere near as stupid and ignorant as the ancient Hebrew authors imagined their male-chauvinistic ignorant God to be.

In many ways even Zeus was a "nicer" God.

[Undeceived]

I see this topic of the God of the Old Testament coming up a lot here. Why does He seem so cruel? Well first we need to examine our definition of cruelty. Cruelty is “willfully or knowingly causing pain to others” or “enjoying the distress of others.” Both of these are accompanied by malice toward the victims. Malice is not part of God’s nature. He has no reason to be angry at His creation, because He created it knowing how it would turn out—a perfect world ruined by our free will. Prior to sending the Flood, Genesis 6:6 says, “The LORD was grieved that he had made man on earth, and his heart was filled with pain.” This was in response to our evil hearts. He was disappointed, though not surprised, that we chose sin over Him. Later, Jesus is seen weeping after the death of Lazarus (John 11:35)—not because he was sad Lazarus had left earth for heaven, but because he felt Mary’s and Martha’s hurt.

Given this evidence, God is good at least in some contexts. If He’s God why would He have mood changes and be ‘bad’ other times? Living apart from time and space, His mind is constant. And because of that mind He sees things more clearly. Why did He order parts of Canaan to be destroyed by the Israelites? We ask this question because we demand justice. Well, those who died deserved death. We all deserve death. God is perfectly good, but He is also perfectly just, meaning someone (Jesus) had to die for our sins if God were to keep His nature. If Jews fabricated the Bible, why would they include the portions you take offense to? Why would they risk deterring you when they could create a fairy tale God who answers our every need? Rather, God seems to contradict Himself because our human minds are not large enough to understand His greater purpose. The Creator is always more complex than the created.

For instance, God views death differently than we do. To Him there is no time. We die when our purpose is finished, be it in infancy or after a hundred years. When God oversaw deaths in Old Testament times, He did not maliciously murder individuals. He was only giving them their due, as a judge condemns a criminal. We look at murder like it is the worst thing in the world. But it is not when your Creator is terminating the life He Himself gave you. God is not bound by our laws or predispositions. In the case of the OT, He was showing us in literal terms what happens to unbelievers after life. God was paving the way for the success of His people. The purpose that mattered most was the coming of Jesus out of Israel. And that included His sacrifice for the life of our souls for eternity. Which is more important?

Carm.org found a pattern in God's OT judgments:
1. God declares an annihilation form of judgment to stamp out a cancer
2. The judgments are for public recognition of extreme sin
3. Judgment is preceded by warning and/or long periods of exposure to the truth and time to repent
4. Any and all ‘innocent’ adults are given a way of escape with their families; sometimes all given a way to avoid judgment via repentance or leaving a particular region. It should also be noted that expulsion from a land was the most common judgment, not extermination.
5. Someone is almost always saved (redeemed) from the evil culture
6. The judgment of God falls

Most everything God did in the Old Testament was to lead us to Jesus, from Passover sacrifices (symbolized in the lamb) to the rule of David (called the Son of David). The Old Testament is a record of our failures, and a visual demonstration of the usually spiritual judgment carried out against us. It shows us how little we can do on our own. We need a gift—someone to pay the price of our crimes. We have all sinned and fall short of the glory of God. God, being just, sends His son Jesus to die in our place. All we have to do is say we’re sorry, make a commitment to loving God instead of ourselves, and accept His gift.

John 3:16-21
16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. 19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.

[genkaus]

I see this topic of the God of the Old Testament coming up a lot here. Why does He seem so cruel? Well first we need to examine our definition of cruelty. Cruelty is “willfully or knowingly causing pain to others” or “enjoying the distress of others.” Both of these are accompanied by malice toward the victims.

Wrong.

Cruelty means "deliberate infliction of pain on others". Malice or enjoyment in the pain may act as indicators, but a infliction of pain on others would be cruel even when there is no malice or enjoyment present. Therefore, the god of old testament would still be a cruel being even if he did not enjoy the infliction of pain.

Malice is not part of God’s nature.

All evidence to the contrary.

He has no reason to be angry at His creation, because He created it knowing how it would turn out—a perfect world ruined by our free will.

You don't think that ruining of a perfect creation is reason to get angry?
Although, I don't think that free will ruins the world in any sense. The fact that you consider free will to be a defect in perfection is very telling, however.

Prior to sending the Flood, Genesis 6:6 says, “The LORD was grieved that he had made man on earth, and his heart was filled with pain.” This was in response to our evil hearts. He was disappointed, though not surprised, that we chose sin over Him. Later, Jesus is seen weeping after the death of Lazarus (John 11:35)—not because he was sad Lazarus had left earth for heaven, but because he felt Mary’s and Martha’s hurt.

So what? Like I said, whether or not he was happy at causing pain is irrelevant. What matters is that he deliberately chose to inflict pain. That makes him cruel.

Also, you are disappointed when things don't turn out the way you hope or expect. If god knew everything, then he had no reason to hope or expect anything different - therefore, no disappointment is possible.

Given this evidence, God is good at least in some contexts. If He’s God why would He have mood changes and be ‘bad’ other times? Living apart from time and space, His mind is constant.

If his mind was constant, then no emotion would be possible to him. He wouldn't be able to grieve, be disappointed or love. Emotions are characteristic to a changing mental state.

And because of that mind He sees things more clearly. Why did He order parts of Canaan to be destroyed by the Israelites? We ask this question because we demand justice. Well, those who died deserved death. We all deserve death.

And how do you go from "some people deserved to die" to "everyone deserves to die" ? Please explain to me why do you deserve to die and I'd be happy to give you what you deserve.

God is perfectly good,

Actually, the only thing you have been able to justify is that he is good in some contexts. That is far from "perfectly good".

but He is also perfectly just, meaning someone (Jesus) had to die for our sins if God were to keep His nature.

What a spectacular example of justice!

Someone has to hang for the crime. Whether the one who hangs is the one who actually committed the crime or not is irrelevant, just as long as someone hangs.

According to your viewpoint, it is alright if one death-row prisoner is let out in exchange for you going to the electric chair.

If Jews fabricated the Bible, why would they include the portions you take offense to?

Because they wrote it for themselves, not us.

Why would they risk deterring you when they could create a fairy tale God who answers our every need?

They did.

Rather, God seems to contradict Himself because our human minds are not large enough to understand His greater purpose. The Creator is always more complex than the created.

Yes, the old "mysterious ways" bullshit. Its amazing what logical convolutions human mind is capable of when trying to preserve a cherished lie.

If something seems to contradict reality in your everyday life, you don't hesitate in calling it a lie. But as soon as "god" is involved, its "mysterious ways" and do not question.

For instance, God views death differently than we do.

Well, then, he needs to die. Only then would he be able to understand our perspective.

To Him there is no time. We die when our purpose is finished, be it in infancy or after a hundred years.

When God oversaw deaths in Old Testament times, He did not maliciously murder individuals.

He did murder them, maliciously or otherwise.

He was only giving them their due, as a judge condemns a criminal.

Except, he punished those who committed no crimes.

We look at murder like it is the worst thing in the world. But it is not when your Creator is terminating the life He Himself gave you.

Bullshit. Once the life is given, it is no longer his to take away.

God is not bound by our laws or predispositions.

Clearly. If he had, he'd have been executed long ago.

In the case of the OT, He was showing us in literal terms what happens to unbelievers after life. God was paving the way for the success of His people.

So was Hitler. All he wanted was to pave the way for success of aryans.

The purpose that mattered most was the coming of Jesus out of Israel. And that included His sacrifice for the life of our souls for eternity. Which is more important?

Mattered to whom? Important to whom? If you ask the Canaanites, I'm sure they'd have a different perspective.

Carm.org found a pattern in God's OT judgments:
1. God declares an annihilation form of judgment to stamp out a cancer

Whether those annihilated did anything to deserve it or not.

2. The judgments are for public recognition of extreme sin

Whether there was any actual sin or not.

3. Judgment is preceded by warning and/or long periods of exposure to the truth and time to repent

Whether they had the capacity for it or not.

4. Any and all ‘innocent’ adults are given a way of escape with their families; sometimes all given a way to avoid judgment via repentance or leaving a particular region. It should also be noted that expulsion from a land was the most common judgment, not extermination.

All? Really? And what about "innocent" children?

5. Someone is almost always saved (redeemed) from the evil culture

A few.

6. The judgment of God falls

You are right. Atleast he's consistent in his arbitrariness.

Most everything God did in the Old Testament was to lead us to Jesus, from Passover sacrifices (symbolized in the lamb) to the rule of David (called the Son of David).

Excepting ofcourse, those he killed.

The Old Testament is a record of our failures, and a visual demonstration of the usually spiritual judgment carried out against us.

Yes, the inability of god to find any peaceful way to impart his message really demonstrates failures on our part.

It shows us how little we can do on our own. We need a gift—someone to pay the price of our crimes. We have all sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

And this is the corrupt vision of man that your religion promotes. Instead of a noble and masterful being, you chose to present him as a crawling, impotent creature. Instead of a being that is capable of standing on his own, you present him as something that is incapable of it, something that needs charity and mercy.

It is not surprising. The first thing one must do to get someone to accept a religion is tell him that he is incapable of self-reliance.

God, being just, sends His son Jesus to die in our place. All we have to do is say we’re sorry, make a commitment to loving God instead of ourselves, and accept His gift.

Even if your fairy tail was true, there is no way any moral person would accept this heinous crime as a "gift". To have a man killed for crimes he did not commit - and not just any man, one that might be looked upon as
a perfect human - that action itself is so corrupt that even the suggestion of looking at it as a good thing must repulse anyone with a shred of morality.

[Cyberman]

What am I supposed to say sorry for? For being human? I've been a human for quite a long time now - born that way, you know - and I'll probably go on being one for at leat the forseeable future. I don't understand why that should require an apology. I'm no saint, I'll admit; I'm subject to the same human drives as the rest of the species. On the other hand, I don't exactly go out of my way to treat other creatures like shit the way I would to help and support them. I have no awareness of ever doing anything for which I need to be sorry, at least anything for which I have not already done so to the person/s concerned.

[Doubting Thomas]

You're supposed to say you're sorry because Adam & Eve disobeyed God by eating the fruit and becoming smart. Apparently God wanted everyone to be dumb animals, and it's supposedly our fault because we're not.